Granny Charger !!!!!!

[Headgas1]

Granny charger

Hi do I use it or not ? Lots of posts suggest it’s dangerous plugs melting cables overheating etc…

Mine doesn’t reach the socket can I use an extension lead again lots say no and yes.

Does anyone out there use it regularly after all it comes with the car !!

I can’t see the the advantage of paying at least £600 for the 7kw socket to just charge the car a bit faster unless you tell me different I could run the car for a year using public chargers for £600

Any thoughts on the subject would be much appreciated

Thanks in advance

 

[Srp111]

Get an extension specially made to the length you need, I did and had no issues with any heat issues.

Bought it from here, fully waterproof as well

Electric vehicle leads

Tough Leads products are renowned on EV forums and Facebook groups for their high quality and reliability. Please see our article on safely charging electric vehicles for advice on extension leads. It is the responsibility of the EV user to consider the manufacturers guidance, the safety of the...

toughleads.co.uk

 

[Sark21]

Hi I'm currently having to use mine to charge at home.its on a descent 10amp extension lead.
It does get just warm,as does the wall plug..Even using a wall box it's recommended to use granny charger occasionally to balance the battery.Hopeful that helps.

 

[Jomarkh]

I used a granny charger for just over a month until I got a 7.5kw box and moved onto Octopus Go.
The granny was taking 12-14 hours to charge from 20-30% to fullish.
The 7.5kw unit makes full use of my four hour slot at 5p/kWh.
You can battery balance on the fast charger but not on a DC rapid unit.
If you use an extension lead make sure it is rated for 13A and as short as possible and fully unwound.

 

[Alb]

Like many I started with the Granny Charger but now have a 32A Charge Point (HyperVolt).
It's more practical because I can get 50% capacity in a single low cost 4 hour timed charge (MG5) and it's safer because both the box and the upstream circuit feeding it is designed and installed to operate continuously with a 32A load.
I never had any problems with the Granny but I wouldn't see it as a long term solution (especially so if extension cables were required).

 

[Kithmo]

I've only used mine once, for 10 minutes, just to check it worked after hearing of a couple of duff ones some people had.
Because I only do about 40-50 miles a week, I initially had planned to use the granny as my main method, I even bought a decent quality, waterproof, 13A continuous rated extension, before I ordered the car, as there are no plug sockets near enough to my drive. Then when I went to purchase, they were doing a "peace of mind" deal where you got a free 7 kW home charger and a type 2 charging cable, so I use the 7kW instead of the granny. About 50% of my charging is at Tescos free 7 kW chargers as well.

 

[Tim Green]

I use the granny all the time except when on long distance trips. It works very well and you can use any extension lead rated at 13A, although the car only takes about 10A. On my car usage I do not need the charge any faster on a day to day basis.

 

[Lovemyev]

I never had any problems with the Granny but I wouldn't see it as a long term solution (especially so if extension cables were required).

You see, I feel the very same way.
I used a supplied "Granny" unit for about seven months, before I had a wall box fitted for charging my previous VW PHEV - This was back in around 2016.
I know owners have used there supplied "Granny" units on a regular basis, to charge their PHEV's & BEV's and that's absolutely fine !.
I used the provided unit for about six months I think ?.
Then I started to see the odd owners where witnessing failures of their units while charging PHEV's and a few BEV's.
Some where replaced under warranty, but a couple had to pay for replacements - not cheap !.
I think that your general usage case, may help you to decide if you should consider a wall box or not.
A "Granny" unit is likely to get a much easier life charging a PHEV of a low mileage user, than the owner of a full BEV - Purely because the size of the battery pack in a PHEV is much smaller than the pack in a BEV - and that's only one reason.
On my previous PHEV - It would take just under about four hours to fully charge the smaller HV battery.
Over that time frame, the top of the three pin 13 Amp plug WOULD get fairly hot.
Not MAD hot, but without doubt, hot.
How hot is hot, I hear you cry.
Well, you would not want to pitch the LIVE brass terminal between your finger and thumb after removing the plug straight from the socket outlet, when it had just finished charging.
It would burn your skin, let's put it that way !.
I know you would NOT do this, but I am trying to give you some idea of the level of heat generated here.
You are passing a constant 10Amps through the terminals of a fuse that is ratted at 13 Amps.
Therefore over a long time scale, heat will be created across that 13 Amp line fuse.
So, when subjecting a "Granny" unit to the same level of load for charging a BEV ( with a much larger battery ) heat IS going to build up without any doubt at all.
You need a GOOD quality socket outlet at the point where you will be charging the car from, that is ideally wired onto it's own dedicated circuit in the C.U.
Charging a mid sized EV battery ( 44+ kw's ) on a "Granny" unit is likely to take its toll on a "Granny" unit over time as well, purely given the length of time the unit is pulling that type of demand.
Something else that maybe worth considering here folks.
IF - Now your only form of transport is now, your lovely new EV .
Question :- Have you considered a "Back Up" plan, SHOULD your "Granny" unit suddenly just decide to fail ?.
If you are lucky enough to live close to either a public charger / rapid and it's working of course, then your covered, until you can get a replacement unit through the dealer network, which may take some time ??????.
So, speaking for myself, after pondering through the above items that I have mentioned above, back in 2016, I made the decision to invest in a wall box.
Not because I am a really high usage case ( 16,000 miles in two years ) but I wanted something that I considered was a more suitable / purpose built EV wall box that future proofed me IF I made the jump into a full BEV ( well we know how that ended - ZS EV of course in 2020 ).
I wanted a device that was built with the ability to provide a much higher given load rate, over a shorter time frame, one that could take full advantage of our cheaper "Off - Peak" rates and provide a charge in the early hours of the morning.
Waking up to a car that had been already cheaply charged, to a SOC level that we wanted to suit our needs, was brilliant.
Charging either a ZS EV or a MG5 ( or pretty much any EV from a low SOC to 100%) was not going to possible, in the cheap "Off - Peak" window on the provided "Granny".
I think "Octopus Energy" offer you about a four hour window, for using their cheaper rate ????.
Well, that's clearly not going to work from a given low SOC and wanting a full charge, from a "Granny" unit.
Four hours of "Off - Peak" is not going to get you any where CLOSE to a full charge.
You will then be forced into charging on your much more expensive standard daily rate tariff, or charge cheaply over two different nights !.
Thats not really practical in many cases.
Therefore, the supplied "Granny" for our PHEV was retired then was only there as the second "Back Up" charger ( should the wall box ever hit a problem ).
The well rested "Granny" unit, then came out when we went on short mini break away, when we knew the charging infrastructure was going to be poor at the location.
Not all places have a charger available, but almost ALL we be helpful in providing a three pin plug socket outlet !.
The ZS EV has been charged ( over the last two years ) via the wall box.
The MG provided "Granny" has made a few trips away and been put to good use, but on our return, it now lives on the garage wall.
I do like having SOME type of a back up plan in my back pocket.
It's just the way I am sorry .
Like having a spare wheel / Type 2 public charging cable / a battery booster pack and a 10mm spanner in the boot, it's just the way I operate.
Not smug, just cautious .
So in conclusion ( at last I hear you say ).
Would I recommend getting a wall box as a better, faster charging solution, that then offers you the back up of using the supplied "Granny" unit as spare - 100% YES YES YES !.
"Granny" units are NOT cheapest thing to replace IF they are not covered under warranty !.
You could be 50% into the price of a wall box, just to replace one.
Maybe THEN you will consider a wall box, I would hazard a bet.
Each to their own I know, but I would never be totally reliant on just a "Granny" unit for my charging needs, that's for sure.
Egg's in one basket, and peace of mind, I think they call it ?.
Or just plain CRAZY, you choose .

 

[Headgas1]

You see, I feel the very same way.
I used a supplied "Granny" unit for about seven months, before I had a wall box fitted for charging my previous VW PHEV - This was back in around 2016.
I know owners have used there supplied "Granny" units on a regular basis, to charge their PHEV's & BEV's and that's absolutely fine !.
I used the provided unit for about six months I think ?.
Then I started to see the odd owners where witnessing failures of their units while charging PHEV's and a few BEV's.
Some where replaced under warranty, but a couple had to pay for replacements - not cheap !.
I think that your general usage case, may help you to decide if you should consider a wall box or not.
A "Granny" unit is likely to get a much easier life charging a PHEV of a low mileage user, than the owner of a full BEV - Purely because the size of the battery pack in a PHEV is much smaller than the pack in a BEV - and that's only one reason.
On my previous PHEV - It would take just under about four hours to fully charge the smaller HV battery.
Over that time frame, the top of the three pin 13 Amp plug WOULD get fairly hot.
Not MAD hot, but without doubt, hot.
How hot is hot, I hear you cry.
Well, you would not want to pitch the LIVE brass terminal between your finger and thumb after removing the plug straight from the socket outlet, when it had just finished charging.
It would burn your skin, let's put it that way !.
I know you would NOT do this, but I am trying to give you some idea of the level of heat generated here.
You are passing a constant 10Amps through the terminals of a fuse that is ratted at 13 Amps.
Therefore over a long time scale, heat will be created across that 13 Amp line fuse.
So, when subjecting a "Granny" unit to the same level of load for charging a BEV ( with a much larger battery ) heat IS going to build up without any doubt at all.
You need a GOOD quality socket outlet at the point where you will be charging the car from, that is ideally wired onto it's own dedicated circuit in the C.U.
Charging a mid sized EV battery ( 44+ kw's ) on a "Granny" unit is likely to take its toll on a "Granny" unit over time as well, purely given the length of time the unit is pulling that type of demand.
Something else that maybe worth considering here folks.
IF - Now your only form of transport is now, your lovely new EV .
Question :- Have you considered a "Back Up" plan, SHOULD your "Granny" unit suddenly just decide to fail ?.
If you are lucky enough to live close to either a public charger / rapid and it's working of course, then your covered, until you can get a replacement unit through the dealer network, which may take some time ??????.
So, speaking for myself, after pondering through the above items that I have mentioned above, back in 2016, I made the decision to invest in a wall box.
Not because I am a really high usage case ( 16,000 miles in two years ) but I wanted something that I considered was a more suitable / purpose built EV wall box that future proofed me IF I made the jump into a full BEV ( well we know how that ended - ZS EV of course in 2020 ).
I wanted a device that was built with the ability to provide a much higher given load rate, over a shorter time frame, one that could take full advantage of our cheaper "Off - Peak" rates and provide a charge in the early hours of the morning.
Waking up to a car that had been already cheaply charged, to a SOC level that we wanted to suit our needs, was brilliant.
Charging either a ZS EV or a MG5 ( or pretty much any EV from a low SOC to 100%) was not going to possible, in the cheap "Off - Peak" window on the provided "Granny".
I think "Octopus Energy" offer you about a four hour window, for using their cheaper rate ????.
Well, that's clearly not going to work from a given low SOC and wanting a full charge, from a "Granny" unit.
Four hours of "Off - Peak" is not going to get you any where CLOSE to a full charge.
You will then be forced into charging on your much more expensive standard daily rate tariff, or charge cheaply over two different nights !.
Thats not really practical in many cases.
Therefore, the supplied "Granny" for our PHEV was retired then was only there as the second "Back Up" charger ( should the wall box ever hit a problem ).
The well rested "Granny" unit, then came out when we went on short mini break away, when we knew the charging infrastructure was going to be poor at the location.
Not all places have a charger available, but almost ALL we be helpful in providing a three pin plug socket outlet !.
The ZS EV has been charged ( over the last two years ) via the wall box.
The MG provided "Granny" has made a few trips away and been put to good use, but on our return, it now lives on the garage wall.
I do like having SOME type of a back up plan in my back pocket.
It's just the way I am sorry .
Like having a spare wheel / Type 2 public charging cable / a battery booster pack and a 10mm spanner in the boot, it's just the way I operate.
Not smug, just cautious .
So in conclusion ( at last I hear you say ).
Would I recommend getting a wall box as a better, faster charging solution, that then offers you the back up of using the supplied "Granny" unit as spare - 100% YES YES YES !.
"Granny" units are NOT cheapest thing to replace IF they are not covered under warranty !.
You could be 50% into the price of a wall box, just to replace one.
Maybe THEN you will consider a wall box, I would hazard a bet.
Each to their own I know, but I would never be totally reliant on just a "Granny" unit for my charging needs, that's for sure.
Egg's in one basket, and peace of mind, I think they call it ?.
Or just plain CRAZY, you choose .

That’s a very long but good answer I think any advice tips r appreciated I was going to take advantage of the lower tariff and charge my ZS when battery was about 60/70% so it would get to 100% whilst using my granny charger !!!

 

[Lovemyev]

That’s a very long but good answer I think any advice tips r appreciated I was going to take advantage of the lower tariff and charge my ZS when battery was about 60/70% so it would get to 100% whilst using my granny charger !!!

Well you did ask .
That’s a perfect plan, until you have run the range down to a lower SOC for a unexpected trip, then you are charging on a daily expensive tariff of course.

 

[Headgas1]

Well you did ask .
That’s a perfect plan, until you have run the range down to a lower SOC for a unexpected trip, then you are charging on a daily expensive tariff of course.

Well you did ask .
That’s a perfect plan, until you have run the range down to a lower SOC for a unexpected trip, then you are charging on a daily expensive tariff of course.

Of course I will have occasional longer journeys and I will find a public charger and do a rapid charge after all that’s what they are there for thanks for your advice though buddy

 

[Tim Green]

I am amazed at the length of your reply!
If you have a plug/socket arrangement that is getting hot, they must be of poor quality. The standard UK 13A is rated at that current on a continuous basis.

As to the security issue, I bought a spare granny unit from Screwfix for £145 which works fine.

 

[Lovemyev]

If you have a plug/socket arrangement that is getting hot, they must be of poor quality. The standard UK 13A is rated at that current on a continuous basis.

Yes - It was a long reply Tim sorry, but maybe I incorrectly though it was important enough to pass on my experience of the use of a "Granny" unit, over using a purpose built EV wall box.
I think you will find that standard UK plug it is not rated by it's "current" value, it is rated in Amps.
I have used both MK and other high end socket front plate(s) and there matching partner three pin 13 Amp heavy duty three pin plugs, used in ever single case, with NO cheap crap used at all.
The test was carried out over a period of seven months of charging nightly on a "Granny" unit.
I can honestly assure you, that the top protection cap of that quality three pin plug WILL still get hot when used over a LONGER period of time.
I have used two different types of "Granny" chargers, to charge both my previous PHEV and now my BEV when we travelled away, in about four different locations around the UK.
and in ALL cases, I have witnessed the same result of heat being generated at the three pin plug / socket outlet.
Cheaper poor quality socket outlet fronts, will definitely allow more heat to be generated, even more quickly of course.
Both cheap and expensive socket outlets are all BS rated for MAX load carrying capacity of 13 Amps.
However, I am pretty sure that any of the items, where not originally designed / engineered in mind, with the intension of carrying a constant and continuous high load of 10amps for use, over hours and hours on end.
Example, if you plug in an electric iron ratted between 2500 - 3000 Watts and increase the heat to max, then after about 30 minutes feel the head of the three pin plug - warm right !.
Similarly with the new fast boil kettles ratted at 3000 Watts at 240 volts, at this load / demand it is pulling 12.5 Amps.
So, now we are pushing hard against that 13 Amp rating all of a sudden.
But in both cases, the load / demand is being pulling over a much shorter time scale than a "Granny" will.
Therefore the heat is reduced greatly in fixtures and fittings.
The "Granny" unit on the other hand is a different story.
Regardless of using high end quality socket outlet etc, there WILL be heat created without any doubt what so ever.
Caution is advised and regular checks on equipment is my best advice.
Wall boxes come with there own set of failure problems as well, usually caused by excessive heat as well strangely enough !.
That is a LONG story, so not for Tim .

 

[Tim Green]

Electrical "current" is the term used when electricity is flowing and it is measured in Amperes (Amps).
If a current encounters a resistance, a voltage drop is created. That voltage drop multiplied by the current flowing is the power (heat) that is being generated. Thus in a plug and socket, if there is a poor connection, heat will be generated.
There is always likely to be some heat generated but this is within the working boundaries of the engineering of the plug and socket. It is only if poor quality plugs and sockets are used that excessive heat is produced and the items fail.
Using a granny charger at 10 Amps should be fine if good quality plugs and sockets are used, even over extended periods.

 

[Lovemyev]

Electrical "current" is the term used when electricity is flowing and it is measured in Amperes (Amps).
If a current encounters a resistance, a voltage drop is created. That voltage drop multiplied by the current flowing is the power (heat) that is being generated. Thus in a plug and socket, if there is a poor connection, heat will be generated.
There is always likely to be some heat generated but this is within the working boundaries of the engineering of the plug and socket. It is only if poor quality plugs and sockets are used that excessive heat is produced and the items fail.
Using a granny charger at 10 Amps should be fine if good quality plugs and sockets are used, even over extended periods.

I am merely trying to fore warning people who have never used a “Granny” unit before, they may not be expecting the head of the three pin plug, to get hot when it is in use for longer periods of time, because it will.
Better quality equipment wired from a dedicated circuit straight from the CU is a better option, but heat will be still be generated given the load passed through a standard 13 Amp plug.
This can ( and has ) resulted in premature failure of these type of “Granny” units over a period of time.
Thanks .

 

[Jto]

Hi
i believe octopus have a go faster which will give you more time to charge a EV

 

[Johnnybee]

Hi Headgas1,
What a can of worms you have opened up here. There's nothing wrong with the poor old "Granny Charger", I've been using one for over 18 months with no adverse effects what so ever. Yes the plug does get hot, ( so would you if you ran for 5 hours or more !! ). If possible use a switched socket to save plugging in every time and if you need an extension use one that has the same rating as the original granny cable.
In my case, I charge in the garage ( switched socket - no extension ) and have noticed that the plug in winter heats to about 7 degree's above ambient temperature and in the summer (such as it is ?? ) about 10 degree's above.
When compared to climates that are much hotter than ours and are using Granny Chargers, I don't think we have too much to be concerned about.
P.S. Who dressed that poor Dog !!!. I bet he really liked that??.

 

[Headgas1]

Hi Headgas1,
What a can of worms you have opened up here. There's nothing wrong with the poor old "Granny Charger", I've been using one for over 18 months with no adverse effects what so ever. Yes the plug does get hot, ( so would you if you ran for 5 hours or more !! ). If possible use a switched socket to save plugging in every time and if you need an extension use one that has the same rating as the original granny cable.
In my case, I charge in the garage ( switched socket - no extension ) and have noticed that the plug in winter heats to about 7 degree's above ambient temperature and in the summer (such as it is ?? ) about 10 degree's above.
When compared to climates that are much hotter than ours and are using Granny Chargers, I don't think we have too much to be concerned about.
P.S. Who dressed that poor Dog !!!. I bet he really liked that??.

Hello Johnnybee
i promise u it wasn’t my intension I genuinely wasn’t sure,the purchase of the car happened quickly and so I hadn’t done enough research and was thinking that I would get the dedicated 7kw socket fitted but was surprised at the costs and couldn’t really affford to fork out another £600 to £1000 pound on top of the car so when you search it up opinions are split so I guess I was looking for some reassurance, but it’s sparked (excuse the pun ) up bit of a debate some of which has gone right over my head I am going to get a good quality extension lead give the granny a go.
And the dog wasn’t me and she loved it for all of 10 seconds if I remember correctly

 

[Lovemyev]

I am going to get a good quality extension lead give the granny a go.

Try and avoid the use of an extension cable if you possibly can and do NOT use it unless it is fully uncoiled !.
Little controversy on this subject I guess .

 

[Dodger]

Hello Johnnybee
i promise u it wasn’t my intension I genuinely wasn’t sure,the purchase of the car happened quickly and so I hadn’t done enough research and was thinking that I would get the dedicated 7kw socket fitted but was surprised at the costs and couldn’t really affford to fork out another £600 to £1000 pound on top of the car so when you search it up opinions are split so I guess I was looking for some reassurance, but it’s sparked (excuse the pun ) up bit of a debate some of which has gone right over my head I am going to get a good quality extension lead give the granny a go.
And the dog wasn’t me and she loved it for all of 10 seconds if I remember correctly

I purchased my MG EV November 2019 and have only ever charged with the Granny Charger plugged into a good quality extension lead. The plug on the Granny Charger is crap and overheated, chopped it off and fitted a good quality MK plug, problem solved! I often leave the car charging for six hours and never a problem.