Rapid charging problem

[Andy Poole]

Hi All,
Had my 2019 ZS EV for 18 months now and always charge at home with no issue. Decided to drop my son into London (From Bristol) so for first time needed to use a public charger. Stopped at one of the new Gridserve DC chargers and found would not communicate with car. Thought it may be charger so off to a Shell charger and same again DC would not communicate with the car. Tried the rapid AC and this did charge car but really slowly, I would think no more than 10kW and the charger was a 43kW charger. Put a couple of miles in and made it to London. Parked at another rapid AC (43kW) and had to sit for 4 hours to get enough charge to get me home (130 miles)!
Anyone else had this? I have had a couple of software updates at service and suspect one hasn't worked as will not charge with doors unlocked. Clearly going to take it into garage this week!

 

[Lovemyev]

Hi All,
Had my 2019 ZS EV for 18 months now and always charge at home with no issue. Decided to drop my son into London (From Bristol) so for first time needed to use a public charger. Stopped at one of the new Gridserve DC chargers and found would not communicate with car. Thought it may be charger so off to a Shell charger and same again DC would not communicate with the car. Tried the rapid AC and this did charge car but really slowly, I would think no more than 10kwh and the charger was a 43kwh charger. Put a couple of miles in and made it to London. Parked at another rapid AC (43kwh) and had to sit for 4 hours to get enough charge to get me home (130 miles)!
Anyone else had this? I have had a couple of software updates at service and suspect one hasn't worked as will not charge with doors unlocked. Clearly going to take it into garage this week!

Hi Andy - That clearly is not right !.
Four hours on a rapid, should have been more like 40 minutes, tops !!.
Yeah, you need to get it back into the dealership mate ASAP.
See, I have to question how quickly it is charging at home ?.
If you just plug in and leave it “Do It’s Thing” then the slower speed could have gone unnoticed.
After all, charging on a 7 kw A/C wall box at home, is the same as using a public charging point, that is suppling 7 kw’s away from home ?.
It sounds to me that the problem has been there a while and you have just not spotted it before.
Do you have a home energy meter ?.
If so, take a note of what the home is pulling, then go at commence a charge on the car.
If you have a 7kw wall box, and the car’s current SOC is less than about 95% the energy meter should be displaying around 7 kw’s of energy being pulled.
This 7 kw’s will be added to the figure you had before you plugged in the car of course.
As a pretty good yard stick, a 7 kw’s unit should give you roughly about 25 miles of range, for every hour you are on charge.
If you are using a “Granny” lead, the time factor will roughly double.
I can feel a new BMS update heading in your direction !.
Are you on a cheaper “Off - Peak” EV tariff Andy ?.
If so, if your car is charging THAT slowly, you are likely to be charging on the standard day time higher tariff because the charge cycle time is WAY to long.
Food for thought .
Yeah - Get it booked in mate !.

 

[Andy Poole]

I agree, problem probably been there for ages. I do have a 7kw wall box and an energy meter and it pulls that no problem. I suspect just no more, at least not much more anyway and it just will not communicate with a rapid dc!

 

[Alb]

I wonder if DC charging is ever checked as part of the PDI?

 

[Lovemyev]

I agree, problem probably been there for ages. I do have a 7kw wall box and an energy meter and it pulls that no problem. I suspect just no more, at least not much more anyway and it just will not communicate with a rapid dc!

Just to clarify, is your home wall box pulling 7 kw’s NOW when you plug in to charge ?.
I am going to say - NOT !.
Very easy to check, I check my energy meter every time I plug in.
It is on the kitchen work top.
I say NOT because this makes little sense at all.
If you are pulling 7 kw’s at the house you should be able to pull the same on a public charging post.
If it was a “comms” problem on a single post, maybe.
But you tried a couple of posts with the same outcome ?.
I think that this problem has manifested itself, when one of them updates where done and you did not pick it up on it, at the time.
It would be helpful to the dealer to know if it’s a A/C or D/C charging problem, or BOTH for that matter.
It is my understanding ( correct me if I am wrong ) that when charging in A/C at home or on public chargers, you are running via the inverter in the car.
When D/C charging ( rapid ) the high current is directed straight to the HV pack.
I think your slow charging speed is on both A/C and D/C.

 

[Lovemyev]

I wonder if DC charging is ever checked as part of the PDI?

Unless the dealer has a rapid on site, then NO is the answer I am pretty sure.
Unless there is a tick box on the PDI sheet, which I very much doubt to be honest.

 

[Andy Poole]

Home charger does pull at 7kw and probably was doing so on the public AC rapid, perhaps a tiny bit more. But no where near the 43kw the public AC could provide hence 4 hr wait for 20 mile - 130 mile range charge. Neither of the DC chargers would work at all the Shell charger said ' charge ended by car' as soon as it was ready to start charge. The Gridserve 'communication problem'. The Shell AC 43kw charged, but really slowly.

 

[Lovemyev]

Okay ?.
So, your home charging is working correctly - Brilliant !.
But if you are plugged into the rapid unit using the type 2 connection, you are not going to pull anything close to the 43 kw’s you expected the unit to provide ?.
Then you should be pulling the same as being at home pretty much.
It’s only the CCS connector that can carry the higher power required to rapid charge.
Clearly you have something wrong in any case on the CCS side, unless you where really unlucky of course.
You could try rapid charging on a good known reliable unit ( like instavolt ) first of course ???.

 

[Andy Poole]

Yep, I will see what the garage says, but you sum up what is happening perfectly.

 

[Kithmo]

The car controls the charge rate on AC, it will only pull around 7kWh (6.6 IIRC) on AC, regardless of what output the charger has.
You'll get between 20 and 25 miles added for each hour on the charger depending on the conditions.

 

[Andy Poole]

Sorry may be my terminology. I plugged into a public CCS and CCS combo. The Combo just does not connect, the CCS charges but only allowing 7kw max ish.
Spoke to garage today and they said they had an MG 5 in with similar problem. Car booked in and told be prepared to leave for a while as don't know whether it will be a simple fix or take to bits job!
Lesson is if you always charge at home and are planning to go on an extended trip where you will need to charge using CCS/ CCS Combo, check at a charger near home first. I made an assumption all would be fine and we all know what assumption can mean!

 

[Lovemyev]

I made an assumption all would be fine and we all know what assumption can mean!

Assumption is the killer of all !.
Good advice.
If your car has received a recent update that maybe connected in ANY way to the charging protocol, then ensure the car charges correctly on a CCS rapid after the update has been applied, is brilliant advice.
Take nothing for granted, it is highly unlikely that the dealer carrying out the upgrade will have access to a CCS Rapid charger on site.

 

[Aseer]

If you can try rapid charging close to home ideally a instavolt / osprey / gridserve , also the following might help.
Once you have checked the charger is working and it asks you to connect the plug in the car.
Do the following, open the charging flap, switch off the car and lock the car, then connect the cable and hold the it in it only needs light pressure. The reasons for holding the connecter at the start is to initiate comms, the cables are heavy and can sometimes find the cable pulls itself slightly out of the charging port. This is well known problem for Polstar 2 so not unique to MG.

 

[Ian Morton]

did

Last April my ZS EV failed to charge at all at a number of DC chargers in Thanet. Was brought home on the back of an AA flatbed. Dealer said it was fine, as it charges on their AC charger. Fixed by a specific software update. It's the AC charging that fails. Bloody nightmare. You're not alone.

Last April my ZS EV failed to charge at all at a number of DC chargers in Thanet. Was brought home on the back of an AA flatbed. Dealer said it was fine, as it charges on their AC charger. Fixed by a specific software update. It's the AC charging that fails. Bloody nightmare. You're not alone.

sorry, on their AC 7kwa charger

sorry, on their AC 7kwa charger

Sorry again. It's the DC charging system that fails

 

[AndyNWuk]

I had exactly the same “connection error” using a Gridserve CCS charger last weekend at IKEA in Manchester. Tried several times using my contactless payment but same error came up. Even after phoning the help line it wouldn’t connect. Gave up on the end and used a charger to top up on the way home but it was an older Electric Highway unit which was very slow.

UPDATE: Sunday 26th September 2021
Did a test charge today using a new Instavolt 50kw DC charger and the CCS Combo. Worked flawlessly on my ZS EV. So must have been a problem with the Gridserve Charger at IKEA Manchester.

 

[AnonymouseDriva]

I plugged into a public CCS and CCS combo. The Combo just does not connect, the CCS charges but only allowing 7kw

I think your understanding may be off slightly. CCS is the combo plug. It’s a Type 2 connector with 2 additional pins on the bottom for DC. The plug without those pins is just an AC Type 2 connector and will only charge at 6.6Kw.
-edit - on the phone.!hopefully moved the image…

 

[lkc]

Gpsnow said:
Just left the kid in kinder garden and tried get out of the parking spot, got that msg - hv battery shut off ???
Could not drive away.
Pressed stop than start a couple of times, finnaly decided to lock the car with the remote and unlocked it and that did the trick.
But what the hell ?

I have similar problem when charging my MG ZS EV (one month old 2nd hand from Chiswick MG, 22 reg) when I FIRST used faster CCS charger at M25 motorway service centre on 1/6/23 and the HD Battery Shut Off came on and not only unable to charge, I can't move the car as HD Battery Shut Off and had to call AA Emergency to fix the fault before I could recharge but the same thing happened yesterday 4/6/23 in Waitrose Wimbledon Shell Recharge CCS charger, again the HD Battery Shut Off came on but this time the AA Emergency engineer computer could NOT talk to my MG and had to wait till this morning 5/6/23 to have the car towed to Chiswick MG workshop on AA flat bed tow truck

It has been in the workshop all day and I am still waiting for their verdict and without a car not even a loan car as originally promised when I bought this car should the car be in service! Very poor service Chiswick MG as apparently both AA engineers said they have encountered this HD Battery Shit Off often and even the MG sales person knew about similar incidence. I have only use the 3 pin slow charger so far as I have a dedicated EV socket at home but have to use CCS fast charge first time last week for long distance driving
lchoong

 

[Lovemyev]

I have similar problem when charging my MG ZS EV (one month old 2nd hand from Chiswick MG, 22 reg) when I FIRST used faster CCS charger at M25 motorway service centre on 1/6/23 and the HD Battery Shut Off came on and not only unable to charge, I can't move the car as HD Battery Shut Off and had to call AA Emergency to fix the fault before I could recharge but the same thing happened yesterday 4/6/23 in Waitrose Wimbledon Shell Recharge CCS charger, again the HD Battery Shut Off came on but this time the AA Emergency engineer computer could NOT talk to my MG and had to wait till this morning 5/6/23 to have the car towed to Chiswick MG workshop on AA flat bed tow truck

It has been in the workshop all day and I am still waiting for their verdict and without a car not even a loan car as originally promised when I bought this car should the car be in service! Very poor service Chiswick MG as apparently both AA engineers said they have encountered this HD Battery sh*t Off often and even the MG sales person knew about similar incidence. I have only use the 3 pin slow charger so far as I have a dedicated EV socket at home but have to use CCS fast charge first time last week for long distance driving
lchoong

There is a software update to the BCM ( body control module ) that is aimed at curing this problem when charging from a rapid unit.
My guess is that the dealer is awaiting instructions from the MG mothership.
Certain dealers tend not to update software on cars unless the car has a problem, or is directly requested for by the owner.
Plenty of incidents on the forum of this type of behaviour unfortunately.
A quick search above will provide evidence.
Regarding a loan car, the AA are able to provide you with a car ASAP for 2 - 3 days.
If the dealership is unable to provide you with a loan car off site, they will then need authorisation from MG after sales ( customer services ) only then they can source loan car from a third party hire company for you.
This is route we had to take when our first ZS EV developed a problem.
We had the hire car for almost four weeks awaiting for £160.00 worth of spare parts to arrive from China !.
If the rapid charger that caused the issue is close to the dealer, then after they update the car, ask one of the EV techs to accompany you after the update has been done and try the car again !.
If they do apply any updates, ask them why they did not install them prior to collection ?.
My guess is they where not done.