The PHEV debate

[Bam Bam]

Probably not one we should get into here as it might cause division in the forum and we wouldn't want that.

But nevertheless, I thought I would share what these journalists think about the PHEV vs. BEV decision.

I'm a car expert: here's why I'd never buy a plug-in hybrid - Which?

No home charging and mostly short car journeys are among the reasons why Which? senior researcher Michael Passingham has ruled out PHEVs, but Dino Buratti has a different view

www.which.co.uk

 

[EvTek23]

Yes indeed, I've seen the argument be quite divisive on this forum. Each will have thier own thoughts on whether a PHEV or a BEV is thier vehicle of choice for thier particular needs.
I went down the full EV route and not regretted it. The range is sufficient for me to use destination charging.
Looking at the way EV's are going, I'm not sure the smaller cars will have a range much better than 350 to 385 miles due to physical size and the ability to fit a large battery pack. It's the bigger cars that have the ability to fit those much bigger packs to achieve 500 to 600 miles, and that's what plays into the hands of the PHEV, it's just how many of those long journeys you make that would make it viable at present. With all the tax changes in 2028 people may change their views on PHEV's.

 

[Ian Key]

I view PHEVs as like dipping your toe in the water before going full BEV for those who are still worried about range and charging in the wild.

 

[Giller]

I view PHEVs as like dipping your toe in the water before going full BEV for those who are still worried about range and charging in the wild.

Totally agree, I wouldn’t have gone full EV if it hadn’t have been for my experience with my plug in Mini Countryman, after 2 year years I realised the benefit of a battery, and it did not have the range offered by the latest PHEVs.

 

[salty]

Interesting arguments. Some slate PHEVS, some love um. But at the end of the day, it's simply what the individual wants. If it makes no sense to others, so what, it doesn't really matter.

 

[Bam Bam]

Some nice constructive responses in the thread here, which is good to see.

Yes indeed, I've seen the argument be quite divisive on this forum. Each will have thier own thoughts on whether a PHEV or a BEV is thier vehicle of choice for thier particular needs.
I went down the full EV route and not regretted it. The range is sufficient for me to use destination charging.

Nicely put. Very diplomatic!

Looking at the way EV's are going, I'm not sure the smaller cars will have a range much better than 350 to 385 miles due to physical size and the ability to fit a large battery pack. It's the bigger cars that have the ability to fit those much bigger packs to achieve 500 to 600 miles, and that's what plays into the hands of the PHEV, it's just how many of those long journeys you make that would make it viable at present. With all the tax changes in 2028 people may change their views on PHEV's.

Interesting. Our old petrol hatchbacks didn't have big tanks, but the one advantage of fuel is it more rapid to refill than a battery.

Yet a lot of PHEVs are massive vehicles - perhaps that is just temporary until people realise electric works.

I was thinking the advantage of the PHEVs might be for people who don't have a driveway, but then they presumably wouldn't ever use the plugin bit, so there wouldn't be much point!

 

[Gadget Geek]

I think in the early adopter phase of BEV's, the range and availability of chargers was a worry if making long journeys, which is where PHEV's originally made sense. Today, BEV ranges have doubled or trebled (depending on how much you pay), and the charging infrastructure is much improved.

With BYD bringing out their new battery tech with 5 minute charging, even this should silence the doubters and detractors.

 

[Rolfe]

When I jumped straight from a Golf to an MG4 several people looked at me and said, you're going pure electric, just like that? As if I'd decided to take up skydiving or bungee jumping. I just said, yes of course. But I never did see the point of hybrids.

My neighbour across the road has one. Just, WHY?

 

[Giller]

When I jumped straight from a Golf to an MG4 several people looked at me and said, you're going pure electric, just like that? As if I'd decided to take up skydiving or bungee jumping. I just said, yes of course. But I never did see the point of hybrids.

My neighbour across the road has one. Just, WHY?

Smartarse, but I mean that as a compliment.

 

[Rolfe]

One of the raised-eyebrows contingent had had an EV for a year or two himself at that point. But then when I found out his attitude to "running on fumes" I thought maybe that explained it.

 

[Susanna]

When I jumped straight from a Golf to an MG4 several people looked at me and said, you're going pure electric, just like that? As if I'd decided to take up skydiving or bungee jumping. I just said, yes of course. But I never did see the point of hybrids.

My neighbour across the road has one. Just, WHY?

I did the same. I had considered going electric 6 or so years previously, but at the time, battery ‘rental’ seemed to be the norm, and at £45 pcm in a Renault Zoe, it just wasn’t worth it for me. I was generally only spending £25 - £30 pcm on petrol.

I haven’t regretted my decision in buying the ZS for a second, as the improvements during that time have been immense.

 

[Anon70]

I guess you could equate the decision in a similar way to why would someone buy a washer dryer when separate washing and drying appliances on the whole do a better job.

It is mostly about what suits the individual circumstances and not minding the compromise. In the case of the washer dryer you can never dry as much as you can wash and you have a single point of failure for your laundry. The advantages are you use less space and only require single set of plumbing and electrics.

If you have a mix of short and long journeys a PHEV is going to let you balance those needs and get the best of both Worlds. It also allows manufacturers to improve their green credentials against targets being set by various Governments.

 

[5teep]

I think it's only a 'debate' between people who like to argue over nothing. You buy the car you need/want and pay the price you can afford.

 

[salty]

I think it's only a 'debate' between people who like to argue over nothing. You buy the car you need/want and pay the price you can afford.

Absolutely totally, agree.

 

[Lovemyev]

I was thinking the advantage of the PHEVs might be for people who don't have a driveway, but then they presumably wouldn't ever use the plugin bit, so there wouldn't be much point!

Of course you are correct @Bam Bam but I know a few people who have PHEV’s and never plugged them in !.
Which I know sounds absolutely crazy .
But I was then told by one of them, that he only got it because of the BIK scheme when it was first released.
I guess the only advantage here, it reduced the number of PHEV’s plugged into public charging posts for hours on end, hogging them from BEV owners, while the driver is at work all day .
Of course, the high price of public charging has now mainly put pay to this type of stupid practice.
A lot of the larger shopping centres offered free charging on 7 kw posts in the early days, to draw in customers to the shops.
When we owned a PHEV we refused to use these posts on the premises that it was blocking a BEV from charging.
Why would take up the post when you had a tank of fuel in the back ????.
We would park and then go along the line of multiple posts and pick out the PHEV’s on charge.
Regularly there would be about 30% of them PHEV’s.
We would spend the day shopping and return to find many of them STILL plugged in .
I think the word is senseless or selfish, take your pick.
I think I have already made it clear, that I have no objections to PHEV’s as an X owners of one.

 

[Bam Bam]

I think it's only a 'debate' between people who like to argue over nothing. You buy the car you need/want and pay the price you can afford.

I know what you mean.

It might be the best choice for some small number of people, which is great.

However, I wonder if a lot of people are choosing them due to FUD (fear, uncertainty and doubt) about EVs. All the negative stories about EVs and might be putting people off going full EV.

Essentially, PHEV might then seem like a sensible middle-way to some consumers who have a driveway to charge but are caught in the headlights of information wars.

In that case it is a shame firstly for that person (if they end up with a car that wasn't the best choice for them) but also the future car fleet in the country (which will have a load of clapped out PHEVs rather than the useful and more efficient EVs that there would have been otherwise).

Obviously this forum is great for targeting FUD because we are discussing the real problems with EVs rather than the fake ones spread by the haters.

 

[Rolfe]

I very much fear that my neighbour has been infected by the FUD, despite the number of EVs in the street. His house is identical to mine, with a large double garage with electricity in place and plenty of room for a charger. (Also a massive south-facing roof with room for even more solar panels than I have.) So far as I know he doesn't do lots of very long journeys. I cannot think of one sensible reason for buying a hybrid. But he did it anyway.

 

[salty]

Because he wanted one. Sensible or not.
That's the only reason, he needs.

 

[Giller]

I very much fear that my neighbour has been infected by the FUD, despite the number of EVs in the street. His house is identical to mine, with a large double garage with electricity in place and plenty of room for a charger. (Also a massive south-facing roof with room for even more solar panels than I have.) So far as I know he doesn't do lots of very long journeys. I cannot think of one sensible reason for buying a hybrid. But he did it anyway.

People are strange….

 

[siteguru]

People are strange….