Government grant

[airdy]

Just got our new MGS5 ,then the government announce a grant for buying a EV, wonder if it can be back dated

 

[DBedford]

Nope, nor will it be available for Chinese cars !

 

[5teep]

Could still be available for MGs, it's not about Chinese so much as how green it is. MG are still trying to determine if their cars will be accepted.
The idea is to boost EV sales, not exclude 50% of manufacturers.

 

[airdy]

Mg are included been announced this afternoon

 

[Everest]

Mg are included been announced this afternoon

reference?

 

[MG Clive]

Mg are included been announced this afternoon

reference?

It hasn't been announced yet according to Auto Express.

"MG is yet to find out if its Chinese-built MG4 and MGS5 EV will be able to meet the sustainability criteria to qualify for the UK Government’s grant"

MG4 and MGS5 EV prices slashed in reply to Government Electric Car Grant | Auto Express

In order to boost sales, MG is announcing its own a £1,500 grant for some of its EVs

www.autoexpress.co.uk

 

[Everest]

that's what I thought, hence asking @airdy

 

[sammoj]

https://www.mg.co.uk/media-centre/mg-announces-ev-grant-support-uk-customers

Looks like MG are doing their own grant to match the government one. Not sure where this leaves my pick up on Thursday, I haven't signed the paperwork yet and did get 4k off list price of Trophy MGS5 and 0% PCP.

I have emailed the dealer to ask for clarification and delay pick up if it means I would qualify for another £1500 discount.

John

 

[NickHeynes]

Could still be available for MGs, it's not about Chinese so much as how green it is. MG are still trying to determine if their cars will be accepted.
The idea is to boost EV sales, not exclude 50% of manufacturers.

I thought it was about how green China is rather than the car itself

 

[sammoj]

Dealer has contacted me and advised they have taken the £1500 off the discount promotion they had so in effect it makes no difference to the current price. He has said he will share the internal documentation with me when I collect as they are a small family firm and want to be transparent in their pricing.

 

[5teep]

I thought it was about how green China is rather than the car itself

Could be but if they base it on advances in 'green-ness' then China comes out waaay ahead of the UK.

"China is experiencing a rapid green energy transition, significantly expanding its renewable energy capacity and aiming to reduce reliance on fossil fuels. China has already surpassed its 2030 renewable energy targets five years ahead of schedule, with impressive growth in wind and solar power. This transition is crucial for meeting global climate goals, as China is the world's largest energy consumer and emitter. "

 

[Bam Bam]

Could be but if they base it on advances in 'green-ness' then China comes out waaay ahead of the UK.

"China is experiencing a rapid green energy transition, significantly expanding its renewable energy capacity and aiming to reduce reliance on fossil fuels. China has already surpassed its 2030 renewable energy targets five years ahead of schedule, with impressive growth in wind and solar power. This transition is crucial for meeting global climate goals, as China is the world's largest energy consumer and emitter. "

It is true that China are going gangbusters on renewables.

However, we started with the wind power a long time before and have stopped using coal, so are a long way ahead when it comes to carbon intensity.

 

[Everest]

Sure, China now have some of the largest solar farms in the world, but also supporting their energy needs with new coal-fired power stations. It's all rather academic though, in my mind, because we (as in UK and several European countries) have only been able to reduce our power needs by shutting down our factories and buying stuff in from China - be it cars, clothes, household goods, electronic devices or books.

Whilst I'm all for reducing global carbon emissions, I see the commitment of the UK to be carbon-neutral by 2050 as an academic/political exercise... unless the emissions that go into that calculation also include the production of "stuff" from other countries that we then import, along with the emissions of transportation of those items.

 

[Archev]

Sure, China now have some of the largest solar farms in the world, but also supporting their energy needs with new coal-fired power stations. It's all rather academic though, in my mind, because we (as in UK and several European countries) have only been able to reduce our power needs by shutting down our factories and buying stuff in from China - be it cars, clothes, household goods, electronic devices or books.

Whilst I'm all for reducing global carbon emissions, I see the commitment of the UK to be carbon-neutral by 2050 as an academic/political exercise... unless the emissions that go into that calculation also include the production of "stuff" from other countries that we then import, along with the emissions of transportation of those items.

A lot of truth in there.

 

[Logan T]

Sure, China now have some of the largest solar farms in the world, but also supporting their energy needs with new coal-fired power stations. It's all rather academic though, in my mind, because we (as in UK and several European countries) have only been able to reduce our power needs by shutting down our factories and buying stuff in from China - be it cars, clothes, household goods, electronic devices or books.

Whilst I'm all for reducing global carbon emissions, I see the commitment of the UK to be carbon-neutral by 2050 as an academic/political exercise... unless the emissions that go into that calculation also include the production of "stuff" from other countries that we then import, along with the emissions of transportation of those items.

Don't forget we also get real national benefits in going green, in terms of improved air quality and a healthier environment.
The anti net zero argument is really one of finding and excuse for doing nothing and continuing with fossil fuels.

 

[OriginalBigAl]

There is also a need to halt Carbon Credits and instead force the polluters to actually change their methods or stop altogether as well as being publicly scrutinised and brought to book . Offsetting is just a means of cooking the books and carrying on as usual. CO2 and pollution are not border specific . If it is truly a world problem it needs world leaders, organisations, countries, all working together on the same song sheet . So we, and more importantly, many species of nature are screwed, the one and only time that has happened was in Independence Day, and that was to commit genocide.

 

[Bam Bam]

Applying the polluter pays principle seems important.

That basically means the consumer (us, well maybe less us than people driving ICE cars) paying the cost of the pollution we cause.

Politically unpopular, obviously, which is why Western countries seem instead to create inefficient subsidies for alternative products instead, which probably just increases consumption.

You can price pollution with taxes, carbon credits, or by regulating industries which pushes up the price.

Regulation can open the door to industry-government shenanigans, unfortunately, so pricing through credits or tax is the safer route.

A Carbon Border Adjustment Mechanism would take care of the carbon import issue and is a very good idea. Though it doesn't stop China selling their more polluting products to countries outside the adjustment zone, so might not help local industry that much. Would mean that consumers are paying a more appropriate amount for imported goods.

 

[Deep purple]

The Government has shot itself in the foot by not allowing dealers to apply for payment of the grant until the car model in question is on the approved list. Retrospective applications are not allowed. No one will want to commit to a car until they know what grants apply to which cars. The timescale for approving manufacturers' submissions is 4 weeks but obviously longer if there are issues, and the manufacturers themselves will take some time to assemble their data. The civil service will all be on its summer holidays in August as well.
1st September will be interesting, will any cars under £37000 be registered? I am about to have an interesting conversation with my dealer about my car due to be picked up on 1st September!

 

[Everest]

Don't forget we also get real national benefits in going green, in terms of improved air quality and a healthier environment.
The anti net zero argument is really one of finding and excuse for doing nothing and continuing with fossil fuels.

hmmm ... I'm not forgetting that and that is not what I said. I'm all for reducing emissions, as I stated. What I was saying is the metrics for the UK's net-zero commitment are not addressing the core issues.

 

[salty]

The Government has shot itself in the foot by not allowing dealers to apply for payment of the grant until the car model in question is on the approved list. Retrospective applications are not allowed. No one will want to commit to a car until they know what grants apply to which cars. The timescale for approving manufacturers' submissions is 4 weeks but obviously longer if there are issues, and the manufacturers themselves will take some time to assemble their data. The civil service will all be on its summer holidays in August as well.
1st September will be interesting, will any cars under £37000 be registered? I am about to have an interesting conversation with my dealer about my car due to be picked up on 1st September!

Agree. It all seems a bit, half-arsed, to me.