No incentive for off-peak charging - daytime burden on grid

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sdsmith1

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Could the electricity grid be overly burdened as Electric Vehicle (EV) owners switch to daytime charging (which is more convenient when you get in from work at 6pm for example) because dual rate EV tariffs have largely been dropped by the utility providers for new contracts or renewals?

Most household EV chargers are 7kWh, which is a significant amount to be drawing a 6pm for example (and probably the equivalent of 3 or more ovens.
 
Octopus offer various off peak prices, especially to EV owners for this very reason. Octopus GO, Agile and Intelligent are aimed at using power outwith times when it's in high demand.

Saying that, I switched to Octopus long before I had an EV, as they seem much more customer orientated than S&SE, my previous supplier. I've had 2 emails this week, giving an update on the Energy Price Guarantee.
 
jackois said:
Octopus offer various off peak prices, especially to EV owners for this very reason. Octopus GO, Agile and Intelligent are aimed at using power outwith times when it's in high demand.

Saying that, I switched to Octopus long before I had an EV, as they seem much more customer orientated than S&SE, my previous supplier. I've had 2 emails this week, giving an update on the Energy Price Guarantee.
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Unfortunately octopus don't offer these rates to new customers at the moment.
 
Tristan Collins said:
Unfortunately octopus don't offer these rates to new customers at the moment.
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If you have and EV or one on order then phone Octopus and explain you want to charge your EV they should but you on a Go or Go faster tariff if you have a SMETS2 smart meter.
 
That's why conspiritorially minded people are suspicious of the mandates for new home chargers to be smart and on their own power supply. That way they can be reduced in power if needed.

I have been told they have to have their own meter but I can only find that they have to have their own circuit in the regs.

SMart charger law/guidance
Regulations: electric vehicle smart charge points

Approved Document S of the building regulations (remember only the bit in the green boxes is law, all the rest are guidance notes)
https://assets.publishing.service.g...uploads/attachment_data/file/1057375/AD_S.pdf
 
Tweed98 said:
That's why conspiritorially minded people are suspicious of the mandates for new home chargers to be smart and on their own power supply. That way they can be reduced in power if needed.

I have been told they have to have their own meter but I can only find that they have to have their own circuit in the regs.

SMart charger law/guidance
Regulations: electric vehicle smart charge points

Approved Document S of the building regulations (remember only the bit in the green boxes is law, all the rest are guidance notes)
https://assets.publishing.service.g...uploads/attachment_data/file/1057375/AD_S.pdf
Click to expand...
They probably only need to have energy usage monitoring instead of an actual meter.
As the Government grants required them to provide statistical data.
 
Perhaps this subject should be re-named

"Great incentives for off-peak charging - daytime burden on grid saved by V2L EV`s"​

 
Tweed98 said:
That's why conspiritorially minded people are suspicious of the mandates for new home chargers to be smart and on their own power supply. That way they can be reduced in power if needed.

I have been told they have to have their own meter but I can only find that they have to have their own circuit in the regs.

SMart charger law/guidance
Regulations: electric vehicle smart charge points

Approved Document S of the building regulations (remember only the bit in the green boxes is law, all the rest are guidance notes)
https://assets.publishing.service.g...uploads/attachment_data/file/1057375/AD_S.pdf
Click to expand...
Interestingly, I Was in a webinar covering this subject (and how we write the software to implement it in home chargers) run by Elaad in the Netherlands.

The main requirements are to protect the grid from overload by adding in a random delay or similar when charging starts to help to alleviate pressure on the grid if all the EVs start charging at the same time when off-peak rates start. These delays, and all of the other requirements of the law, can be overriden each time by the chargepoint owner. There is no requirement for a dedicated meter to be installed.

Whilst the law applies only to private CPs in the UK the group has already seen other EU countries looking in a very similar direction and expects such requirements to become common place across the EU soon.
 
Tweed98 said:
That's why conspiritorially minded people are suspicious of the mandates for new home chargers to be smart and on their own power supply. That way they can be reduced in power if needed.

I have been told they have to have their own meter but I can only find that they have to have their own circuit in the regs.

...
Click to expand...
Wow, do these people wear tin foil hats as well. I like smart so I can time charges. I like smart so that if the grid did become under stress I and others could help out by reducing the load a tiny tiny tiny bit. I like smart so when I'm charging and if I turn on my electric oven and the electric shower is on and I'm reaching household capacity it will reduce the power to save my house.
Worrying about a smart charger reducing power...so what big deal, really useful.
I bet they are the same people that would complain about carrying an ID card but quite happily freely give all details about their life and friends and their whereabouts by using social media.
:cool:
 
New smart charger being made currently, will have a facility to “Stall” the charging session to a latter time of day / evening to avoid the possibility of overloading the grid at high demand peak times.
It CAN be over ridden if you urgently required a charge, but it will not automatically commence a charge when first plugging in at peak times.
I think “my energy” have already started this process on their units ( Zappi etc ).
Old dumb units are not affected by this of course.
 
chromeskull said:
They probably only need to have energy usage monitoring instead of an actual meter.
As the Government grants required them to provide statistical data.
Click to expand...
The smart only rules came in at the start of June and the home charger grant finished in April or May so not linked, but they probably do want the data.
 
Lovemyev said:
New smart charger being made currently, will have a facility to “Stall” the charging session to a latter time of day / evening to avoid the possibility of overloading the grid at high demand peak times.
It CAN be over ridden if you urgently required a charge, but it will not automatically commence a charge when first plugging in at peak times.
..
Click to expand...
Isn't that similar or same as Intelligent Octopus ?
 
I have no idea 🤷.
But the new units will not charge by default at peak times if you are on a single rate tariff, by all accounts.
They will hold off on the charge cycle until the demand on the grid has dropped.
It’s an attempt to stop EV drivers all arriving home at similar times after work and then all plugging in their cars and spiking the demand on the grid, all at the same time.
This will be the default method apparently, but can over ridden for emergency use, is my understanding.
“My energy” ( of Zappi fame) have been involved in this process and the boss did a piece to camera 🎥 recently.
 
Lovemyev said:
the new units will not charge by default at peak times if you are on a single rate tariff, by all accounts.
They will hold off on the charge cycle until the demand on the grid has dropped.
Click to expand...

Only if you use the default setting of charge by a certain time either by a set amount or to a given % where available.

Lovemyev said:
default method apparently, but can over ridden for emergency use
Click to expand...

The required time can be moved to any time, so it can cause charging to start immediately if desired. E.g., arrive home at 18:00 wanting 20kWh, set a target time of 21:00 and charging will commence immediately. Alternatively just ask for a boost charge and it starts anyway but has to be done each time.
 
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