Wheel nuts

[john1000uk]

Call me daft but I've removed the locking wheel bolts and put the original bolts back. Being new and before the winter corrosion set in I figured they'd come off ok. Reason is I don't want a corroded bolt on a black, wet cold night (puncture) and being told the head has stripped as the bolt was seized. Beauty is you cannot tell with the plastic cap in place as they all look the same.

 

[salty]

I'm probably being a bit fik. But don't quite follow, what you mean.

 

[TimothyN]

I'm not fik, I understand, but is it really a thing? I guess it's a balance of risk...

 

[Alb]

Mine were never fitted in the first place. They are still in a bag in the boot and that's probably where they'll stay.

 

[john1000uk]

Mine were never fitted in the first place. They are still in a bag in the boot and that's probably where they'll stay.

Mmm does that reflect on the sales outlet?

Mine were never fitted in the first place. They are still in a bag in the boot and that's probably where they'll stay.

No you're not, I'm just a bit suspicious of how much torque a locking wheel nutt can take if its seized in place by salt and rust

 

[salty]

No you're not, I'm just a bit suspicious of how much torque a locking wheel nutt can take if its seized in place by salt and rust

As long as they are correctly torqued up, they will be fine. A dab of Copper grease on the thread is also a good idea. I've never had a seized Nut, (oh matron) or bolt. On any car I've owned.

 

[MG Clive]

As long as they are correctly torqued up, they will be fine. A dab of Copper grease on the thread is also a good idea. I've never had a seized Nut, (oh matron) or bolt. On any car I've owned.

Hmmm, I was always taught never to apply any sort of grease to my wheel nuts.

 

[salty]

Hmmm, I was always taught never to apply any sort of grease to my wheel nuts.

Never had a problem ever. Never had a wheel overtake me. I'm talking a small dab, spread around the threads. And torqued up correctly.

 

[Alb]

Stated torque is invariably based on dry threads so anything that reduces thread friction will result in over-torque.

 

[salty]

Stated torque is invariably based on dry threads so anything that reduces thread friction will result in over-torque.

Don't agree. Never had a problem, ever.
They've always come off, easily. And I've done a lot, over the years.

 

[john1000uk]

As long as they are correctly torqued up, they will be fine. A dab of Copper grease on the thread is also a good idea. I've never had a seized Nut, (oh matron) or bolt. On any car I've owned.

Yes there's a lot of pros and cons but I figured if I removed them to perhaps add a touch of copper slip then I may as well change them for the full headed bolts. There's so many ham fisted guys out there I really don't want a conversation entailing my wheel bolt supposedly being seized and the locking part being bludgeoned.

 

[MG Clive]

So a bit of Googling says, Grease - No, Copper grease - Yes.

Asking if it's ok to use grease on wheel nuts.

No, you generally should not use grease on your wheel nuts or studs because it drastically changes friction, leading to severe over-tightening, stretched bolts, and potentially a wheel coming loose, which is extremely dangerous; always follow the manufacturer's specs for dry threads, using only a clean, dry connection unless specific anti-seize (like copper grease) is used sparingly on the mating face and torque adjusted, which is rare for standard vehicles.

Asking if it's ok to use copper grease on wheel nuts.

Yes, you can use copper grease (anti-seize) on wheel nuts and studs to prevent seizing and corrosion, making future removal easier, but use it sparingly and significantly reduce the manufacturer's recommended torque setting (by about 30%), as lubrication reduces friction, or ideally, apply it to the hub face and studs only, not threads, keeping threads clean and dry as per best practice for accurate torque application, say experts.

 

[James Dean Driving School]

This is the world where the customer still believes anyone uses a torque wrench on wheel nuts.

 

[john1000uk]

This is the world where the customer still believes anyone uses a torque wrench on wheel nuts.

So a bit of Googling says, Grease - No, Copper grease - Yes.

Asking if it's ok to use grease on wheel nuts.

No, you generally should not use grease on your wheel nuts or studs because it drastically changes friction, leading to severe over-tightening, stretched bolts, and potentially a wheel coming loose, which is extremely dangerous; always follow the manufacturer's specs for dry threads, using only a clean, dry connection unless specific anti-seize (like copper grease) is used sparingly on the mating face and torque adjusted, which is rare for standard vehicles.

Asking if it's ok to use copper grease on wheel nuts.

Yes, you can use copper grease (anti-seize) on wheel nuts and studs to prevent seizing and corrosion, making future removal easier, but use it sparingly and significantly reduce the manufacturer's recommended torque setting (by about 30%), as lubrication reduces friction, or ideally, apply it to the hub face and studs only, not threads, keeping threads clean and dry as per best practice for accurate torque application, say experts.

Interesting, from feel alone I'd say my dealer had correctly done up the locking wheel nuts. Moving on I've never had a nut or bolt come loose on its own after fitting when its had a smear of copper slip. However it wasn't standard practice to smear wheel nuts. (Even though I thought about it this time). Has anyone got any links to manufacturers data on reduced torque settings when using a thread lubricant from oil to greases? Am I guilty of overtightening some fixtures all these years?

 

[Alb]

Don't agree. Never had a problem, ever.
They've always come off, easily. And I've done a lot, over the years.

Whether you agree or not is irrelevant.
It's a basic engineering fact.

 

[salty]

Whether you agree or not is irrelevant.
It's a basic engineering fact.

It's not irrelevant at all. Comes from years of experience and changing a lot of wheels. To know it does no harm, whatsoever.

 

[dx4100]

It's not irrelevant at all. Comes from years of experience and changing a lot of wheels. To know it does no harm, whatsoever.

Well you said you disagreed with basic physics. Not sure you will ever win that argument

Im not much of a DIY person but I've always know a torque setting is based on a dry thread.

 

[MG Clive]

It's not irrelevant at all. Comes from years of experience and changing a lot of wheels. To know it does no harm, whatsoever.

What Alb was saying, is that whenever a manufacturer states a torque setting (for any nut or bolt), the setting is assuming the threads are clean and dry, not greased in any way, and that is an indisputable fact which nobody can disagree with. That's why Alb said your disagreement of the basic fact was irrelevant.

Fact is different to opinion.

 

[salty]

This is the world where the customer still believes anyone uses a torque wrench on wheel nuts.

I do when, when I'm swoping/changing wheels. It's not that unbelievable. My preferred Tyre shop, always does. Torque wrenches are not that expensive. Ok a puncture at the side of the road, when it's Dark and pissing down, you wouldn't, that's fair enough.

 

[salty]

What Alb was saying, is that whenever a manufacturer states a torque setting (for any nut or bolt), the setting is assuming the threads are clean and dry, not greased in any way, and that is an indisputable fact which nobody can disagree with. That's why Alb said your disagreement of the basic fact was irrelevant.

Fact is different to opinion.

Agree, you can't argue with basic facts.
But it's always worked for me, with no problems whatsoever, and I'll carry on doing it that way. It's my opinion. Certainly not irrelevant, wether it's a "fact" or not.
Just a way of doing it, that works, perfectly. We can all spout basic facts, doesn't mean, they can't be tweaked for the better.