1st Charge Advice

gkay2021

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Aberdeen
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MG ZS EV
Just received my new ZS Ev Exclusive on Wednesday and had a quick question about charging.

  • Should I let the battery go to completely empty for the first charge? (First charge will be done with a rapid charger as still waiting for my home point to be installed)
  • Is it good practice to let the battery run down once a month?
  • At what point do people normally charge there battery at if using the car daily?
  • Is it always best to charge to 100% or 80%?

Thanks for any advice in advance.
 
You'll see a whole range of opinions here.
One camp will recommend "do what you like" whilst another will insist the world is going to end if you ever dare to stray outside a range of 20-80%.
As a starting point, just read the owner's manual to be clear what MG say but treat that as guidance. Ultimately, do what you find most convenient and remember that the car is there to serve you, not the other way around.
There is no benefit in doing anything extreme like running the battery to zero.
 
Don't let it go flat in case the charger you pick has issues.
Then you're buggered to drive to the next one.
 
Hi, go between 40-80% most days as that's my commute.
We were away the weekend and got home with 8% remaining.
I do a battery balance once a month but that can not be done on a DC rapid just fast or 'granny' AC.
Try not to take the rapid over 85-90%.
 
Well just did my first charge with the type 2 cable at my local charge point.

For some reason battery reads 440v but only shows 121 miles and there is 1 bar left.

When I went to get the car my cable that was attached to the charging point was lying on the ground (thinking someone probably pulled it out as a joke on a sat night after a few to many beers) sadly hadn’t got round to fitting my dashcam yet.

Otherwise can’t see why it would have notified me it had finished charging even though it wasn’t full?

1636846637338.png
 
If the car was locked, you shouldn't be able to detach the cable.
Was it forced?
 
Oh dear! That's where I go to recharge when I visit friends and family in Aberdeen :oops:

As Alb said, when you lock your car, the charging cable should be locked and only released when you unlock the car (to prevent people pulling out the charging cable as the car's charging as you could damage the charging system - I did that when I first got my Mitsubishi Outlander hybrid and I 'bricked' my car and had to get it onto the back of the big yellow taxi to the dealer for a reset!).

Also, forgive me if I'm teaching Granny to suck eggs but, as above, if you're charging at a rapid charger, you MUST stop the charge at the charger before unplugging the cable.

Is your car alright? I'd plug in the granny charger and lock the car and see if you can pull out the charging cable. On the slower charger, you can pull out the charger before the end of the charge if you must but I'd always advise stopping the charge if you can - just in case!

Cheers

Bloggsy
 
ISTR reading somewhere that there is a brief moment where if you press the door button without the key, the cable lock releases but relocks again within 2 seconds IIRC.
 
The car was locked while charging. It is a 22kwh charger. The cable itself was still in my vehicle it had just been removed from the charging point. I tested it today when locked at the same charging port and can confirm it couldn’t be removed from my car.
 
The car was locked while charging. It is a 22kwh charger. The cable itself was still in my vehicle it had just been removed from the charging point. I tested it today when locked at the same charging port and can confirm it couldn’t be removed from my car.
The charger end should be locked in as well (if your car is not fully charged at least). Pulling the plug out of the charger when current is flowing could damage your onboard charger.
 
  • Should I let the battery go to completely empty for the first charge? (First charge will be done with a rapid charger as still waiting for my home point to be installed)
  • Is it good practice to let the battery run down once a month?
  • At what point do people normally charge there battery at if using the car daily?
  • Is it always best to charge to 100% or 80%?
I often let it get down to 5/10miles when we are running errands around town, knowing that there are loads of chargers on the streets near us, and I can charge at home too. I really like the knowledge that I have an exact amount of miles left so can work out if I can do a 3mile round trip without worrying. I suppose I could do this with a petrol car but somehow it didn't seem as reliable, even though I am sure it would be.

I haven't seem any drop in range over the last 18months having done 12k miles, so I dont think the 80/100% matters too much. I think you would need to speak to an electric car battery maker/specialist to confirm or deny this. I'm not sure forum hearsay would be able to prove anything over a 2 year period with so many variables in play.

Having seen your logo, you should try out all the street chargers we have here around Craven Cottage - we're very lucky! Although it's a long round trip from Aberdeen. COYW.
cheers
nick
 
I often let it get down to 5/10miles when we are running errands around town, knowing that there are loads of chargers on the streets near us, and I can charge at home too. I really like the knowledge that I have an exact amount of miles left so can work out if I can do a 3mile round trip without worrying. ....................
nick
If your battery was at 100% you could do a 3 mile round trip too. :)
I prefer to graze electrons taking them when and wherever I can to keep topped up. I really like the knowledge that if something crops up I can just jump in and go without having to think about charging first.
 
I am new to this forum and new as a EV owner, but there a couple of things that you need to consider when it comes to batteries.

With Nickel Cadmium batteries there is an effect that can happen due to the chemistry of the battery. If you keep charging your battery just to a certain level the battery will develop what is usually referred as the "memory effect". This means that your battery will not reach 100% of it capacity, it will "remember" a lower charge level. That is why in the past, with Ni-Cd batteries many manufactures recommended to initially perform a 3 complete charge and discharge cycles to the battery so you can ensure a complete range of usability on a new battery. Eventually as the battery gets old that range will become shorter to the point that it will charge in a very short time but also discharge even faster.

With Lithium-Ion (Li-Ion) or Lithium polymer (Li-Po) battery the chemistry is completely different and the charge/discharge requirements are very different. You don't need to initially cycle your battery. Also Li-Ion batteries can not go all the way down to a complete discharge because then it will be very difficult to get them receive charge again.

As with the other battery chemistry to get them charge to around 80% capacity is not a complex process but to get to the remaining 20% to get to a total of 100% usually involves a more complex process called trickle charging.

Your EV already has software parameters and monitors to provide the security that the specific battery requires and they will manage the charge and discharge cycle in a secure manner so you maximize the usage of your battery. There is a great deal of complexity on managing the chemistry of your battery and that is why everyday there is a lot of research on how to maximize this process.

Yes it is true that is not good to get your battery to a complete discharge, but in reality what is shown to you as complete discharge is just your car systems telling you that you will get to a point where you can compromise the security of your battery so it will disconnect all systems to protect it.

Also the practice of not charging to a 100% is commonly used not only to avoid the long time that trickle charging takes to cover the extra 20% to get to 100% but also to avoid the issues that comes with the inbalance of every individual cell. But in general there is nothing wrong with getting you battery to 100% once in while but manufacturers recommend not to keep the battery at a 100% all the time. Also it is very important that you preform the recommend balance cycles that the car manufacturer recommends because this will ensure the system to supervise the condition of all the cells in the system.

Another recommended practice is to do partial charge/discharge cycles. Using only 20% or 30% of the battery capacity before recharging will extend cycle life considerably. As a general rule, 5 to 10 shallow discharge cycles are equal to one full discharge cycle. Although partial-discharge cycles can number in the thousands, keeping the battery in a fully charged state also shortens battery life.

When you charge a battery the ionization interchange process on the battery causes an exothermic reaction as with many other chemical reactions. So the faster you charge the more temperature increase happens on the battery. The same happens on the discharge cycle. This rise on the temperature can be dangerous and create decay on the internal estructure of the cell. That is why your EV has a cooling system to manage the rise of temperature and avoid damage to the battery. So if you avoid a rapid charge cycle the temperature rise will be minimal and will allow to dissipation process to maintain a safe temperature level. So in general slow charges when possible are better than fast charges for you battery.

That been said, you acquire a car so you can drive around, not to become a nanny for its battery. So enjoy your new car, trust that the manufacturer has put in place systems to secure the charge and discharge cycles so you are not going to compromise the security of the battery. Charge when needed and if possible (and this is a personal view point I am not saying that everybody should do this) avoid fast charges when possible.
 
Last edited:
Hi, nice article.
When you talk about slow and fast charging are you talking about AC and DC ie fast and rapid or slow as in 'granny'?
 
Hi, nice article.
When you talk about slow and fast charging are you talking about AC and DC ie fast and rapid or slow as in 'granny'?
Yes. A granny charger (level 1 < 2 Kw) or a home charger (level 2 < 7 Kw) will take time to charge your battery allowing the internal temperature of your EV battery not to rise too fast. A public DC charger (Level 3 40 Kw and more) will charge your battery very fast but also will rise the internal temperature of the battery.

As a general rule battery internal temperature increase will shorten the life of it. The same logic can be applied at the discharge rate. When the requirement of energy is very high the battery will provide it but it will get hot on the process so avoid to drive in sport mode all the time.

As I mention before there is nothing wrong with charging at a 100% or even on a DC public station as a quick top up. The EV is designed to withstand those cycles. If you want to maximize the life of the battery you just need to avoid doing it all the time.

Use your car as you please and charge it when you get home regardless of how low the charge is. Do not leave it connected for weeks at a 100% and charge in public fast charging stations only if you must. And also try not to run all the way down if possible

I hope this helps
 
I am new to this forum and new as a EV owner, but there a couple of things that you need to consider when it comes to batteries.

With Nickel Cadmium batteries there is an effect that can happen due to the chemistry of the battery. If you keep charging your battery just to a certain level the battery will develop what is usually referred as the "memory effect". This means that your battery will not reach 100% of it capacity, it will "remember" a lower charge level. That is why in the past, with Ni-Cd batteries many manufactures recommended to initially perform a 3 complete charge and discharge cycles to the battery so you can ensure a complete range of usability on a new battery. Eventually as the battery gets old that range will become shorter to the point that it will charge in a very short time but also discharge even faster.

With Lithium-Ion (Li-Ion) or Lithium polymer (Li-Po) battery the chemistry is completely different and the charge/discharge requirements are very different. You don't need to initially cycle your battery. Also Li-Ion batteries can not go all the way down to a complete discharge because then it will be very difficult to get them receive charge again.

As with the other battery chemistry to get them charge to around 80% capacity is not a complex process but to get to the remaining 20% to get to a total of 100% usually involves a more complex process called trickle charging.

Your EV already has software parameters and monitors to provide the security that the specific battery requires and they will manage the charge and discharge cycle in a secure manner so you maximize the usage of your battery. There is a great deal of complexity on managing the chemistry of your battery and that is why everyday there is a lot of research on how to maximize this process.

Yes it is true that is not good to get your battery to a complete discharge, but in reality what is shown to you as complete discharge is just your car systems telling you that you will get to a point where you can compromise the security of your battery so it will disconnect all systems to protect it.

Also the practice of not charging to a 100% is commonly used not only to avoid the long time that trickle charging takes to cover the extra 20% to get to 100% but also to avoid the issues that comes with the inbalance of every individual cell. But in general there is nothing wrong with getting you battery to 100% once in while but manufacturers recommend not to keep the battery at a 100% all the time. Also it is very important that you preform the recommend balance cycles that the car manufacturer recommends because this will ensure the system to supervise the condition of all the cells in the system.

Another recommended practice is to do partial charge/discharge cycles. Using only 20% or 30% of the battery capacity before recharging will extend cycle life considerably. As a general rule, 5 to 10 shallow discharge cycles are equal to one full discharge cycle. Although partial-discharge cycles can number in the thousands, keeping the battery in a fully charged state also shortens battery life.

When you charge a battery the ionization interchange process on the battery causes an exothermic reaction as with many other chemical reactions. So the faster you charge the more temperature increase happens on the battery. The same happens on the discharge cycle. This rise on the temperature can be dangerous and create decay on the internal estructure of the cell. That is why your EV has a cooling system to manage the rise of temperature and avoid damage to the battery. So if you avoid a rapid charge cycle the temperature rise will be minimal and will allow to dissipation process to maintain a safe temperature level. So in general slow charges when possible are better than fast charges for you battery.

That been said, you acquire a car so you can drive around, not to become a nanny for its battery. So enjoy your new car, trust that the manufacturer has put in place systems to secure the charge and discharge cycles so you are not going to compromise the security of the battery. Charge when needed and if possible (and this is a personal view point I am not saying that everybody should do this) avoid fast charges when possible.
As an electrical engineer for over 40 years rmoyao's post is the best I've ever seen regarding batteries, everything he says is correct. Enjoy your car and don't worry, the manufacturer guarantees it for 7 years, I'm sure they don't want to have to replace lots of batteries, thats why they build in management systems to protect it
 
Just received my new ZS Ev Exclusive on Wednesday and had a quick question about charging.

  • Should I let the battery go to completely empty for the first charge? (First charge will be done with a rapid charger as still waiting for my home point to be installed)
  • Is it good practice to let the battery run down once a month?
  • At what point do people normally charge there battery at if using the car daily?
  • Is it always best to charge to 100% or 80%?

Thanks for any advice in advance.
Just don’t worry about it. I recharge my MG every night and use it every day. I’ve had it nearly 2 yrs and have done 33000 miles and had no issues at all
 
The recommendation from ALL battery manufacturers and MG is to keep your battery between 20-80% most of the time, no camps, views or opinions just from the people who should know!

Not doing so has 2 outcomes: -

1 - more electricity required to charge at high / low percentages.
2 - marginally faster battery capacity loss over time if take to 100% or down to 0% frequently.

MG also recommend charging up to 100% for a balancing charge about once a month.

Not doing so results in the car having less available capacity as the battery management plays safe.
 
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