MG ZS EV Owner shame on you

[weedavemac]

There is no need to explain anything. You are using the charger until it suits you to finish.

 

[WalkingBootWeather]

There is no need to explain anything. You are using the charger until it suits you to finish.

On the contrary I'm introducing a stop point which might not suit the person (could be you or me) that insists on charging beyond 80% because it suits them?

If someone brings cakes into the office is it better to share between all team members or is it 'you snooze you lose'?

Good etiquette gives everyone a chance to take on sufficient energy with minimal wait time. If everyone take the view that they will charge as long as they want then we will all end up waiting longer.

 

[weedavemac]

Again, why 80%? Who decided this figure beyond which you are displaying bad form?

Cakes are bad for you.

 

[WalkingBootWeather]

Again, why 80%? Who decided this figure beyond which you are displaying bad form?

Cakes are bad for you.

Because at 80% charge rate falls rapidly.

It is more efficient for a ZS EV to move on at around 80%, to allow someone waiting to get a rapid charge, and to make a further stop if necessary when charge rates will be higher.

 

[weedavemac]

Not for me, sorry. At 80% still charging faster than a regular fast charger. I don't want the hassle of trying to find another charger which might not be working, might be busy etc etc. Charge it once, charge it well.

 

[JodyS21]

Because at 80% charge rate falls rapidly.

It is more efficient for a ZS EV to move on at around 80%, to allow someone waiting to get a rapid charge, and to make a further stop if necessary when charge rates will be higher.

The problem with stating a straight 80% cut off, is different cars charge at different rates at different SOC. The new ZS BMS allows the charge to be faster at a higher SOC.
I've charged up to the high 80s % before now and it didn't slow down much before I ended the charge.

 

[WalkingBootWeather]

This is not about a hard percentage value because, as you say, different cars charge at different rates and lots of factors including starting SoC and battery temperature impact this further.

It is about making a limited infrastructure support the greatest number of cars with minimal average and maximum wait times. To achieve this we need some mechanism to encourage people to move on after they have had a reasonable chance to charge, and ideally once their charging rate begins to taper.

It is about putting yourself in the shoes of the person waiting rather than the shoes of the person charging so together ensuring nobody is waiting for an exceptionally long time to access a charger if that can be avoided.

I appreciate that once charging there is a temptation to dwell as long as possible in the hope you won't need to find another charger, but if everyone takes this same view you too will end up waiting longer.

Clearly we all have different levels of empathy for other ev drivers, so relying on good will and etiquette is not going to work. That's why tariffs and enforcement is necessary. If I had a pound for everyone who told me that simply had to get up to 90%+ on a free rapid to complete their journey, then amazingly found another solution once charges were introduced, I'd have enough to buy us both a pint .

 

[Dr Dave]

It is about making a limited infrastructure support the greatest number of cars with minimal average and maximum wait times. To achieve this.....

What we need urgently are more charging stations. Imagine a world where we had ice cars and few petrol stations or a lack of petrol supplies (sounds familiar) chaos quickly ensues. More EV's and too few charging stations will ensure chaos occurs more quickly than we might think.

 

[JodyS21]

This is not about a hard percentage value because, as you say, different cars charge at different rates and lots of factors including starting SoC and battery temperature impact this further.

It is about making a limited infrastructure support the greatest number of cars with minimal average and maximum wait times. To achieve this we need some mechanism to encourage people to move on after they have had a reasonable chance to charge, and ideally once their charging rate begins to taper.

It is about putting yourself in the shoes of the person waiting rather than the shoes of the person charging so together ensuring nobody is waiting for an exceptionally long time to access a charger if that can be avoided.

I appreciate that once charging there is a temptation to dwell as long as possible in the hope you won't need to find another charger, but if everyone takes this same view you too will end up waiting longer.

Clearly we all have different levels of empathy for other ev drivers, so relying on good will and etiquette is not going to work. That's why tariffs and enforcement is necessary. If I had a pound for everyone who told me that simply had to get up to 90%+ on a free rapid to complete their journey, then amazingly found another solution once charges were introduced, I'd have enough to buy us both a pint .

Fully agree.
I’ll be controversial now and say, get rid of free chargers, replace them with at least a nominal charge per kWh/min. Would that help elevate the problem, folk would then only charge on them when they actually really needed to?

 

[jamesie]

Fully agree.
I’ll be controversial now and say, get rid of free chargers, replace them with at least a nominal charge per kWh/min. Would that help elevate the problem, folk would then only charge on them when they actually really needed to?

Agree wholeheartedly Jody. I live in an area where the rapid chargers are free and it does encourage poor charging behaviour. It doesn't help with the growth of the charging infrastructure or the timely maintenance of the chargers.

A reasonable price for charging with overstay penalties is what's required IMO.

 

[DuracellBunny]

Why 80%? What happens if you need more?

Law of diminishing return applied to EV says above 80% charging becomes a lot slower. If you cover long distances is never worth going above 80%, stop for an extra charge to cut down the total charging time.

 

[Gomev]

Law of diminishing return applied to EV says above 80% charging becomes a lot slower. If you cover long distances is never worth going above 80%, stop for an extra charge to cut down the total charging time.

Well that depends on whether that extra % up to say 90% makes the difference between having to stop again or reaching your destination.

 

[JodyS21]

What we need urgently are more charging stations. Imagine a world where we had ice cars and few petrol stations or a lack of petrol supplies (sounds familiar) chaos quickly ensues. More EV's and too few charging stations will ensure chaos occurs more quickly than we might think.

Commercial profits should sort this all out really, the only reason we have as many petrol stations is purely for commercial reasons. Does this mean though that prices for charging will go up in order to get companies to invest in installing them - at least initially until they are used more often to get the investment payback?

 

[JodyS21]

Well that depends on whether that extra % up to say 90% makes the difference between having to stop again or reaching your destination.

Exactly what I was going say @Gomev !

 

[WalkingBootWeather]

Well that depends on whether that extra % up to say 90% makes the difference between having to stop again or reaching your destination.

You are proposing a scenario where you are arriving at a rapid charge point and need to charge up to 90% to reach your destination. This is on a ZS EV thread and it is November so I'm going to suggest that is a distance of say 115 miles that will take you over 2 hours. To eek out range you might have to drive slower than you want or without heating on. Pretty much anything could happen in that time to alter your plans - an accident, a diversion, weather change, need to take a comfort break. etc. You'd be likely to arrive at your destination quicker and more happy with a 30 min stop and a second 10 minute 'splash and dash' than by charging for an hour at the first stop then trying to do the journey in a single go.

 

[DuracellBunny]

Not for me, sorry. At 80% still charging faster than a regular fast charger. I don't want the hassle of trying to find another charger which might not be working, might be busy etc etc. Charge it once, charge it well.

Show me a stretch of road between two chargers longer than 80 miles with no other chargers in between

 

[biffo]

You are proposing a scenario where you are arriving at a rapid charge point and need to charge up to 90% to reach your destination. This is on a ZS EV thread and it is November so I'm going to suggest that is a distance of say 115 miles that will take you over 2 hours. To eek out range you might have to drive slower than you want or without heating on. Pretty much anything could happen in that time to alter your plans - an accident, a diversion, weather change, need to take a comfort break. etc. You'd be likely to arrive at your destination quicker and more happy with a 30 min stop and a second 10 minute 'splash and dash' than by charging for an hour at the first stop then trying to do the journey in a single go.

That’s all true - assuming there are available chargers en route. Otherwise, (and if you’re not blocking anyone else) the slower charge speed above 82-ish% might make more sense.

 

[biffo]

Show me a stretch of road between two chargers longer than 80 miles with no other chargers in between

There are plenty of Rapid/Ultra-rapid chargers - but fewer that are working, not in use or blocked. Especially in more remote areas.

Here is a perfect example :

 

[weedavemac]

Show me a stretch of road between two chargers longer than 80 miles with no other chargers in between

Why would I want to stop again in an 80 mile journey?

I don't have the time to look for stretches of road without a charger. However, can you guarantee that the next charger up the road will be working? Charge it well...charge it once

 

[weedavemac]

You are proposing a scenario where you are arriving at a rapid charge point and need to charge up to 90% to reach your destination. This is on a ZS EV thread and it is November so I'm going to suggest that is a distance of say 115 miles that will take you over 2 hours. To eek out range you might have to drive slower than you want or without heating on. Pretty much anything could happen in that time to alter your plans - an accident, a diversion, weather change, need to take a comfort break. etc. You'd be likely to arrive at your destination quicker and more happy with a 30 min stop and a second 10 minute 'splash and dash' than by charging for an hour at the first stop then trying to do the journey in a single go.

The 10 minute splash and dash could well be impossible by a non working charger. Then the journey will certainly be slower. Charge it well - charge it once.