MG ZS EV Owner shame on you

Biffo says it well

More chargers.
Reliable chargers.
Faster chargers.

And the issue would no longer be relevant.

I have just contacted a local councillor re chargers. He is actively looking into a couple of issues for me. Pressure needs to be put on local and national government to highlight the problems and try to get some worthwhile change.
 
Agree with you @biffo There is no need to make things complicated, we are trying to simplify this process to make it easier for everyone.
We are all familiar with the concept of max parking times in a car park/on the roadside, etc. and fines for over staying. This is a very simple notion that could easily be used and understood by the public.
This is already being done by some charger companies without any fuss or commotion.
 
So let's assume your car SOC was at a point where you could take on board 50kWh AND it actually charged at 50kW ( :ROFLMAO: )
Then 50 kWh at 12.5p is £6.25. Add in 60 mins at 12.5p which is £7.50 final bill of £13.25, the equivalent of 26.5p /kWh. Not too bad.
However we know that we don't always get top speed so costs will be higher, and if you could afford an expensive car that can charge quicker then it may be cheaper.
Personally I'm not in favour of being charged by time as well as for the cost of the materials, after all I wouldn't want to be charged extra for waiting longer in a supermarket queue at the checkout.
We have one national (non-tesla) network and so its what we have! Occasionally I hear of poor connection speeds but generally we’ve had no issue.

The good thing is that as you go >80% then cars do slow down and so the time cost increases.
 
So let's assume your car SOC was at a point where you could take on board 50kWh AND it actually charged at 50kW ( :ROFLMAO: )
Then 50 kWh at 12.5p is £6.25. Add in 60 mins at 12.5p which is £7.50 final bill of £13.25, the equivalent of 26.5p /kWh. Not too bad.
However we know that we don't always get top speed so costs will be higher, and if you could afford an expensive car that can charge quicker then it may be cheaper.
Personally I'm not in favour of being charged by time as well as for the cost of the materials, after all I wouldn't want to be charged extra for waiting longer in a supermarket queue at the checkout.
I don't really understand why the reluctance against billing per minute plus per kWh.
As long as it's is fair - in other words works out about the same as what it costs us now, then I can't see the problem, and it fixes the issues caused by folk staying plugged in for excessive amounts of time.
I don't believe it really makes it any more complicated for people charging either, it's very straightforward (and it is not like we have to add up the billing for the machine lol).
It would just be a case of deciding the fair price per minute, so that it is on a par with what it is currently, using a rate of something like 40-50kW sounds about fair.
 
I don't really understand why the reluctance against billing per minute plus per kWh.
As long as it's is fair - in other words works out about the same as what it costs us now, then I can't see the problem, and it fixes the issues caused by folk staying plugged in for excessive amounts of time.
I don't believe it really makes it any more complicated for people charging either, it's very straightforward (and it is not like we have to add up the billing for the machine lol).
It would just be a case of deciding the fair price per minute, so that it is on a par with what it is currently, using a rate of something like 40-50kW sounds about fair.
You don't believe it makes it more complicated ? Comparing price per kWh (simple) versus price per kWh plus price per minute (more factors). One is clearly more complicated than the other. You are right we do not have to add up the billing for the machine, but it would be a fool that didn't check it.

Fair ? So a vehicle that can charge faster than mine usually a more expensive one, will be able to charge quicker and therefore more cheaply than me for the same goods.

Fair ? We all know charging rates vary depending on many circumstances, SOC, temperature of battery, temperature of weather, so the price would vary depending on weather as it would take longer to charge the same amount in winter compared to summer. - Perhaps we should all get a winter fuel allowance.

I fear you are trying to solve a problem by creating another. Overstaying is easily solved by simply charging for overstaying, not by fiddling with the cost of the commodity. The best solutions are often the simplest.
 
You don't believe it makes it more complicated ? Comparing price per kWh (simple) versus price per kWh plus price per minute (more factors). One is clearly more complicated than the other. You are right we do not have to add up the billing for the machine, but it would be a fool that didn't check it.

Fair ? So a vehicle that can charge faster than mine usually a more expensive one, will be able to charge quicker and therefore more cheaply than me for the same goods.

Fair ? We all know charging rates vary depending on many circumstances, SOC, temperature of battery, temperature of weather, so the price would vary depending on weather as it would take longer to charge the same amount in winter compared to summer. - Perhaps we should all get a winter fuel allowance.

I fear you are trying to solve a problem by creating another. Overstaying is easily solved by simply charging for overstaying, not by fiddling with the cost of the commodity. The best solutions are often the simplest.
We'll have to agree on having differing opinions on this one.

I do think it is very fair to also bill by time.
From a business perspective, companies installing/operating the chargers, need to make a profit otherwise they will not install them - and we need them to install more. Their costs are fixed and variable, covering their fixed costs is proportional to the amount of time the unit is available.

An overstay £charge sorts out people leaving their cars connected once they are fully charged, but it doesn't discourage people from charging at a really slow rate and tying up the unit when at the higher SOC.

In theory by also billing by the minute, the costs for normal folk like ourselves using these chargers to only usually charge to around 80%ish, would be lower than they are currently, as the companies can make the same overall profit with lower £per kWh&minute.

IMHO I do not think the mentioned super market analogy is appropriate. Unless you add in a restriction that only a few people are allowed in the shop at any one time (the same as only 1 car can use a charger at a time), if this were the case supermarkets would change the way that they charge.


I know this actually makes things more complicated!!!!! which no one wants, but I can imagine it going one stage further and the following happening at some point:-
Charger units have more than one CCS cable/plug so multiple cars can charge concurrently should there be enough capacity.
It billing at X pence per kWh PLUS the customer chooses the charging rate
Xpence per minute up to 25kWh
Xpence per minute up to 50kWh
Xpence per minute up to 75kWh....etc
From a setup costs perspective, it wouldn't cost much to add additional CCS cables to the unit; DC chargers have multiple converters fitted within them to get the kW allowable output, the more of these the higher the unit cost, so these could be routed individually to each car and therefore get the additional investment back (thus the rate price banding based on the number of/size of the converters)
 
We'll have to agree on having differing opinions on this one.
I agree we will agree to disagree. :)

In theory by also billing by the minute, the costs for normal folk like ourselves using these chargers to only usually charge to around 80%ish, would be lower than they are currently, as the companies can make the same overall profit with lower £per kWh&minute.
Since when in the real world would the cost go down?

I know this actually makes things more complicated!!!!! which no one wants,
We agree on that.

but I can imagine it going one stage further and the following happening at some point:-
Charger units have more than one CCS cable/plug so multiple cars can charge concurrently should there be enough capacity.
It billing at X pence per kWh PLUS the customer chooses the charging rate
Xpence per minute up to 25kWh
Xpence per minute up to 50kWh
Xpence per minute up to 75kWh....etc

From a setup costs perspective, it wouldn't cost much to add additional CCS cables to the unit; DC chargers have multiple converters fitted within them to get the kW allowable output, the more of these the higher the unit cost, so these could be routed individually to each car and therefore get the additional investment back (thus the rate price banding based on the number of/size of the converters)
...and more and more complicated. Can I refer you to your previous comment that we both agree upon.

I know this actually makes things more complicated!!!!! which no one wants,
 
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