Solar PV - no roof space

[biffo]

Friend of mine in a conservation area, put 4kWh solar PV on his summer house lying flat, and produces almost as much power as me. on a pitched S.E. Roof you should be fine,

Laying flat is superb for summer months but more of an issue in winter with the low sun angles. Even seen some people mount vertical east panels for winter sun.

 

[bribagz]

six months is better than none

 

[AK OK]

Such an optimist @AK OK
No reason to think overnight cheaper tariffs won't be around for many many years to come. Surplus of generation, with little industry or offices working overnight has to go somewhere. Power generation cannot be switched off and on with a flick of a switch.
Economy rates have been around since the 60s I think and will continue for a long time yet.

Hehe

"No reason" ?
The elephants are already in the room - Charging increasing numbers of EVs & house batteries !

All this "20 year payback on investment" stuff assumes too much will stay the same... Even a small change in the financials stands to break the economics of these finely balanced gambles.

I'll wait for fusion

 

[Taq]

£15k for a battery?
I've been quoted significantly less than that for a 4.8kWp PV system with a 10kWh battery.

I paid about a 1/3 less than that for 5.7Kwp PV with 12kwh battery & the link to drive my hot water cylinder with the excess solar

 

[AK OK]

I paid about a 1/3 less than that for 5.7Kwp PV with 12kwh battery & the link to drive my hot water cylinder with the excess solar

Devil's always in the detail...

 

[Gomev]

Devil's always in the detail...

...and there were none in your post.
Forgive me but you seem very negative towards home electric generation and battery storage and off peak electricity.

 

[AK OK]

...and there were none in your post.
Forgive me but you seem very negative towards home electric generation and battery storage and off peak electricity.

Which post are you referring to?

 

[Gomev]

Which post are you referring to?

Thence to the payback calculations?

Sounds like £20k+ investment to partially power your household, but how much power & for how long?

There's lots of assumptions in there though isn't there?
Big one being you can't just knock 4000 kWh off your yearly electricity bill - You have to use it as it is generated otherwise you get SFA by selling it to the grid & buying it back (at full price) when you do use it.
Or is there another £15k for a battery knocking about too? & even then....
Inverter lifespans? Panel efficiency degradation? Damages/replacements? Wear & tear?
Not sure myself...

Hmm & presumably at some point the cheapo nighttime "spare" electricity will no longer be given away "for nought" as demand outstrips supply...

 

[AK OK]

So no detail you say?
Erm.....

 

[Gomev]

So no detail you say?
Erm.....

All guesses and questions

 

[AK OK]

Like payback assumptions

And of your contributions to this thread?....

 

[Hotlush]

I'm sure I've already said it 2 or 3 times but once more for luck;

I'm not expecting to go "off-grid".
If I do nothing I'm looking at my electric bill increasing by £150-200+ in September when my fixed tariff ends. Possibly much more when the October cap raise kicks in.
Or I could put ~£150 on the mortgage, get a summer house with PV and keep the bill at roughly the level it is now. I may even reduce the bill significantly, but that would be a bonus.

 

[Robf]

I had solar panels in my last house, which we used to charge car via Zappi (type 1), also on octopus go, and have the following observations.

• Only effective in summer on non cloudy days, this will hugely restrict when you can charge car (forget all of winter and most of autumn and spring).
• I fitted a power diverter to heat water first
• On intermittant cloudy days you are pulling some free electricity, and some at normal cost, this makes it cheaper than normal charge, but generally more expensive than octopus go cheap rate.
• I eventually found it cheaper to charge on octopus go during 12.30 to 4.30
• Without the FIT payment I personally do not see any financial gain in solar panels nor batteries (unless you charge the batteries on octopus go or similar).
• There is the setting on zappi (and I am sure other chargers) where they only turn on when sunny and off when cloudy (From memory about 1.5kwh), I was reluctant to use this as I suspected the constant on / off might damage batteries.

Rob

 

[Hotlush]

I had solar panels in my last house, which we used to charge car via Zappi (type 1), also on octopus go, and have the following observations.

• Only effective in summer on non cloudy days, this will hugely restrict when you can charge car (forget all of winter and most of autumn and spring).
• I fitted a power diverter to heat water first
• On intermittant cloudy days you are pulling some free electricity, and some at normal cost, this makes it cheaper than normal charge, but generally more expensive than octopus go cheap rate.
• I eventually found it cheaper to charge on octopus go during 12.30 to 4.30
• Without the FIT payment I personally do not see any financial gain in solar panels nor batteries (unless you charge the batteries on octopus go or similar).
• There is the setting on zappi (and I am sure other chargers) where they only turn on when sunny and off when cloudy (From memory about 1.5kwh), I was reluctant to use this as I suspected the constant on / off might damage batteries.

Rob

Got a BP home charger and no economic reason to change it so will stick to the Go window for charging.
Even better, first year of car lease (when it arrives) comes with a free year of Bonnet app charging. Spend every Thursday evening literally 2 minutes from an Osprey 50kw for 1.5 hours so could shift a good chunk of my weekly use on that.

 

[AK OK]

I had solar panels in my last house, which we used to charge car via Zappi (type 1), also on octopus go, and have the following observations.

• Only effective in summer on non cloudy days, this will hugely restrict when you can charge car (forget all of winter and most of autumn and spring).
• I fitted a power diverter to heat water first
• On intermittant cloudy days you are pulling some free electricity, and some at normal cost, this makes it cheaper than normal charge, but generally more expensive than octopus go cheap rate.
• I eventually found it cheaper to charge on octopus go during 12.30 to 4.30
• Without the FIT payment I personally do not see any financial gain in solar panels nor batteries (unless you charge the batteries on octopus go or similar).
• There is the setting on zappi (and I am sure other chargers) where they only turn on when sunny and off when cloudy (From memory about 1.5kwh), I was reluctant to use this as I suspected the constant on / off might damage batteries.

Rob

Aligns with my thoughts.

May I ask - on the setup you describe - was the FIT the older more generous one?

 

[Robf]

Hi

Yes, it was on the more generous FIT contract, it made it worthwhile. I have a EO fitted in the new house, but have not fitted solar panels as yet, and will not until it becomes near cost effective. Similar with batteries, I doubt they will ever give payback without some type of grant.
I also had an air source heat pump, and would advise at this stage to avoid as they have problems at low temperatures (just when you need them).

Best regards
Rob

 

[AK OK]

Hi

Yes, it was on the more generous FIT contract, it made it worthwhile. I have a EO fitted in the new house, but have not fitted solar panels as yet, and will not until it becomes near cost effective. Similar with batteries, I doubt they will ever give payback without some type of grant.
I also had an air source heat pump, and would advise at this stage to avoid as they have problems at low temperatures (just when you need them).

Best regards
Rob

I agree.

It would appear to be a rather fundamental problem with the whole renewables "argument" - that when you need to use the power it's not necessarily being generated renewably.

Hydroelectric storage potential is miniscule, battery storage is still in its infancy & uneconomic.

So you need to build/rely on traditional (gas,coal) generation to bridge the gap/night/winter. Traditional technologies designed & built to run "flat out" for maximum efficiency, turning them off & on or even "up/down a bit" knackers that efficiency in short order, never mind the carbon cost.

Add in the carbon climate crisis & you're left with nuclear generation as the only acceptable option.

And to the crux - if you're going to have to build sufficient carbon friendly generating capacity to cover the "too windy, dark northern european winter" days & nights as they happen, why are we wasting time forcing everyone (through green bill levies) to subsidise so-called "green" windmills & solar panels?

 

[Solar powered]

I have solar panels on my shed roof. They have been running very reliably for 8 years this month. I am an electrician so installed the whole system myself.
Happy to advise with real world facts and figures, rather than speculative twaddle.

 

[Solar powered]

Don't get too focusses on the angle and direction of your roof. I have 40 panels on my shed roof which has a shallow angle and faces South East. The sun rises on the wrong side of the roof but I still get strong solar generation from 10am til around 5 pm at the moment. My inverter restricts the generation to 5.5kw max and at this time of year I see around 4.5kw max.
It's been running for 8 years this month. Generated 40,000kw and exported 30,000kw in this time. Hence the quest for an electric car. My home usage is around 10 units a day from the grid. It was 3 times that before I fitted the panels.

 

[Gomev]

Don't get too focusses on the angle and direction of your roof. I have 40 panels on my shed roof which has a shallow angle and faces South East. The sun rises on the wrong side of the roof but I still get strong solar generation from 10am til around 5 pm at the moment. My inverter restricts the generation to 5.5kw max and at this time of year I see around 4.5kw max.
It's been running for 8 years this month. Generated 40,000kw and exported 30,000kw in this time. Hence the quest for an electric car. My home usage is around 10 units a day from the grid. It was 3 times that before I fitted the panels.

WOW that's some sized shed.