Batteries : MG4 SE SR versus Trophy LR

[Roger001]

Me awaits @Rolfe .......

That is exactly how the MG4 feels compared to an MGB.

 

[gary333]

Sure a spoiler can be a useful styling exercise, but no manufacturer adds weight to a car in the form of a spoiler that does nothing to reduce the cd factor. That's even if it's just by one or two points. Gary, think about that for a moment.

If you think for a second that all car manufacturers are designing cars based on optimal engineering principles then you are living in cuckoo land unfortunately.

Plenty of detailed articles going back decades showing that many car rear spoilers are not reducing drag but quite the opposite. Plenty of manufacturers publish this data in their Tech sheets themselves.

 

[Data]

At Longbridge?

No.

If you think for a second that all car manufacturers are designing cars based on optimal engineering principles then you are living in cuckoo land unfortunately.

Plenty of detailed articles going back decades showing that many car rear spoilers are not reducing drag but quite the opposite. Plenty of manufacturers publish this data in their Tech sheets themselves.

Not sure who is living in cloud cuckoo land here Gary. But it doesn't sound as if you know much about modern car engineering. Today, it's all about optimal engineering. And yes indeed, I was someone that actually part wrote the manuals for car & motorcycle manufacturers so I know about the spec side of things. I cannot speak for all manufacturers of old but trust me, no manufacturers over the last 20yrs fits a spoiler if it's just for show. If it's an aesthetic enhancement it always has to have a cd benefit too. It's actually a rule of engineering. Getting more efficiency/range is critically important, with manufacturers going to quite extreme measures to achieve this, some even breaking the law to get what they want (VW). It has to have a cd benefit. Everything is all about getting best range whether it's ice or EV. Aero-dynamics is particularly important.

I'd be very interested to know where you are seeing this plentiful evidence about car rear spoilers NOT reducing drag & actually increasing it. There are differences in spoilers of course, some fitted to aid braking, some for anti lift while others are for aesthetics. But all have to have some amount of cd reduction. Some spoilers are purely for cd reduction.

Anyway, nice to hear your opinions Gary. Bye for now.

 

[Bam Bam]

I'm not an engineer, but always thought that rear spoilers were to add downforce and improve grip, which would reduce efficiency.

I noticed that if you look at the most efficient EVs they don't tend to have rear spoilers and instead are very curved.

https://ev-database.org/uk/#group=vehicle-group&rs-pr=10000_100000&rs-er=0_500&rs-ld=0_500&rs-ac=2_23&rs-dcfc=0_300&rs-ub=10_200&rs-tw=0_2500&rs-ef=150_600&rs-sa=-1_5&rs-w=1000_3500&rs-c=0_5000&rs-y=2010_2030&s=8&p=0-10

The Tesla 3 has a sort of spoiler-y thing I suppose, but it is nothing like the one on the MG4, which I was led to believe (perhaps wrongly) was aesthetic and did not improve efficiency.

 

[Data]

I'm not an engineer, but always thought that rear spoilers were to add downforce and improve grip, which would reduce efficiency.

I noticed that if you look at the most efficient EVs they don't tend to have rear spoilers and instead are very curved.

https://ev-database.org/uk/#group=vehicle-group&rs-pr=10000_100000&rs-er=0_500&rs-ld=0_500&rs-ac=2_23&rs-dcfc=0_300&rs-ub=10_200&rs-tw=0_2500&rs-ef=150_600&rs-sa=-1_5&rs-w=1000_3500&rs-c=0_5000&rs-y=2010_2030&s=8&p=0-10

The Tesla 3 has a sort of spoiler-y thing I suppose, but it is nothing like the one on the MG4, which I was led to believe (perhaps wrongly) was aesthetic and did not improve efficiency.

Hi Bam Bam, yes it's all very interesting this spoiler thing. Spoilers are used for a number of reasons but primarily (in most cases) to improve efficiency especially of vehicles with less than ideal aerodynamics. My own ZS EV has a spoiler above the rear window. It's sole purpose is to reduce drag by improving the cd figure. My car is essentially brick shaped so the spoiler helps somewhat. It has no other real purpose. It certainly doesn't shield the rear screen from road spray & dirt but it may help a little. And that is the same for the majority of cars on the roads. It doesn't necessarily need to be a big 'wing' type as on the MG4 & thus can melt into the car design almost unnoticed. The MG4 spoiler is designed to stand out & help efficiency at the same time. How much extra efficiency it provides is the question.

 

[Roger001]

I'm not an engineer, but always thought that rear spoilers were to add downforce and improve grip, which would reduce efficiency.

I noticed that if you look at the most efficient EVs they don't tend to have rear spoilers and instead are very curved.

That is the point of adding a spoiler to the more brick-shaped cars (such as the MG4). Its job is to improve the air flow over the back.

The thing is that the low air pressure zone found at the back does not just cause one effect. Instead, it causes drag and lift, so any added spoiler added is designed to do the best it can to reduce one or both issues. If the spoiler is providing downforce, this just means it was designed to overcompensate for lift.