Cold Gate Distance and Charging 5th Dec

[Mark Holmes]

Hi all,
I thought I share this information with you; don’t know what use it is, but you may or may not be interested anyway. (Photo’s below to support my account).
Today I completed a 250 mile work road trip to Brentwood, Ipswich, Bury St Edmonds, Milton Keynes and then home again...mostly motorways with a speed of 65 - 70 Mph. Conditions not great 2 degrees and wind and rain. My total distance average reached 3 miles per KWh on this trip.
Started fully charged with predicted range in (N) of 191 miles with no heater and 162 miles with the heater on, however after 100.2 miles I needed to charge as only 22 miles remaining in (E) or 21 miles in (N) remaining with heater on, this is about what I expected in these conditions and glad it wasn’t worse.
My average since the Comfort 2 installation is still 4.1 miles / KWh over the last 6346 miles.
Charging update.
1st charge with GeniePoint was slower than I ever experienced before 1 hour and 28 mins for 29.49 KWh
2nd charge with BP pulse at Milton Keynes was better 41 mins for 24.4 KWh.
I don’t know if the above is useful or insightful, but hopefully it is to some.

 

[Mgkev]

@Mark Holmes , thanks for sharing this info. I have been looking into using our MG for some longer journeys we do but with my own research and your post above I’ve decided to keep our Prius PHV for these trips.

 

[Mark Holmes]

@Mark Holmes , thanks for sharing this info. I have been looking into using our MG for some longer journeys we do but with my own research and your post above I’ve decided to keep our Prius PHV for these trips.

I was very disappointed with today’s experience as in the warmer months the range was much better and I was much more comfortable, in the summer I would have possibly got away with one stop; hopefully anyway...

 

[Mgkev]

Cold gating is still a very real issue for EVs , something that is rarely mentioned in revues. A car that is just in range for a summer journey can become a real PITA in the depths of winter. My Prius in cheaper to use than Rapid charging the MG for my intended trip. Plus the two chargers that would be ideal for me are often out of service according to Zap-Map

 

[Richie]

Hi all,
I thought I share this information with you; don’t know what use it is, but you may or may not be interested anyway. (Photo’s below to support my account).
Today I completed a 250 mile work road trip to Brentwood, Ipswich, Bury St Edmonds, Milton Keynes and then home again...mostly motorways with a speed of 65 - 70 Mph. Conditions not great 2 degrees and wind and rain. My total distance average reached 3 miles per KWh on this trip.
Started fully charged with predicted range in (N) of 191 miles with no heater and 162 miles with the heater on, however after 100.2 miles I needed to charge as only 22 miles remaining in (E) or 21 miles in (N) remaining with heater on, this is about what I expected in these conditions and glad it wasn’t worse.
My average since the Comfort 2 installation is still 4.1 miles / KWh over the last 6346 miles.
Charging update.
1st charge with GeniePoint was slower than I ever experienced before 1 hour and 28 mins for 29.49 KWh
2nd charge with BP pulse at Milton Keynes was better 41 mins for 24.4 KWh.
I don’t know if the above is useful or insightful, but hopefully it is to some.

Mark
Good feedback and just shows that one needs to watch the miles remaining and not go by what you see when you start. Makes planning that little more difficult and important.

 

[Jake]

Hi Mark. Very detailed progress figures and pics for your extended journey. Great stuff. Your initial GOM reading figures must have been calculated using your overall average mile/kWh with recalculations reducing the range according to your current driving conditions. This is quite encouraging meaning that the GOM can be used confidently knowing that although it may give best case range, it will also adapt to whatever is actually happening at the time. Many thanks for such detail.

As an aside how did you like the facilities (or lack of) at the Milton Keynes coach way BP hub? I've used that point several times since just after it opened and has never been busy but just as well because 2 or 3 of the 8 units at any one time seem to be faulty. The comfort facilities (and I bet they were closed) are almost non-existent which is a shame being so close to the M1 yet nothing else to offer for a reasonable break.

 

[Chrispydoc]

Yes it makes you think......It's not just the cost of the electricity, but the hanging around waiting for the charging.
I too will definitely be hanging on to my PHEV......Mind you, in this 'Covid Climate'.....not many of us are going very far anyway......

 

[Mark Holmes]

Hi Mark. Very detailed progress figures and pics for your extended journey. Great stuff. Your initial GOM reading figures must have been calculated using your overall average mile/kWh with recalculations reducing the range according to your current driving conditions. This is quite encouraging meaning that the GOM can be used confidently knowing that although it may give best case range, it will also adapt to whatever is actually happening at the time. Many thanks for such detail.

As an aside how did you like the facilities (or lack of) at the Milton Keynes coach way BP hub? I've used that point several times since just after it opened and has never been busy but just as well because 2 or 3 of the 8 units at any one time seem to be faulty. The comfort facilities (and I bet they were closed) are almost non-existent which is a shame being so close to the M1 yet nothing else to offer for a reasonable break.

First time I used it and there are plenty of chargers, I used the Old Polar (Now BP) and they were fine, but it was fairly dark and remote which is okay for us chaps, but not very security reassuring for any ladies....I don’t think I’d be happy for my wife to be there on her own after dark.

 

[Mark Holmes]

Yes it makes you think......It's not just the cost of the electricity, but the hanging around waiting for the charging.
I too will definitely be hanging on to my PHEV......Mind you, in this 'Covid Climate'.....not many of us are going very far anyway......

I think once the temperature is up to about 8 to 10 degrees I may try this trip again to see the difference and to be honest I normally drive at about 60 mph, but for this test I wanted to push the sort of normal speed and therefore on the motorway I did stay between the 65 to just over 70 mph.

 

[RobMgZsEV]

@Mark Holmes I've just started to test my car this week after Christmas Break, my daily commute is 65-70 miles on A-road, same trips for last 13 yrs (4 in EV) so I can notice if some usual values are out of scale. Reason for my test is that since first service with all nessesary updates in November I've noticed that something isn't right with range, also recently there is alot of mention to #BMSgate range issues. So with 2 trips so far I took some notes to calculate power usage/range. My avg mpkWh is 3.1 in this weather. First trip 100%-16% and pumped in 27kWh, trip2 100%-29% pumped in 24kWh, so futher calculations suggests that with not taking losses to it 84% of battery = 27kWh and 71%=24kWh which gives around 33kWh available battery capacity. Some people mention battery pack Voltage when full should be close to 455V mine on both examples in the morning was 439V....I will carry my tests till end of week to collect more data. All kWh values are from my EV charger dedicated meter and Ohme charger.

 

[Mark Holmes]

Yes the BMS update according to the forum on Monday has been acknowledged by MG and has been pulled for the time; hopefully it will be corrected soon. My car still won’t charge unlocked on a home charger and therefore I deduce mine doesn’t have this update at present. I’m sure it will be rectified soon; how are you enjoying the car to drive?

 

[ARealHuman]

Thanks for sharing the detials. I've only ever got over 4Kwh once, and even driving like I'm driving Miss Daisy still doesn't usually yield that. I accelerate with the flow of the traffic, which is often that quick, does everyone else accelratevery slowly in this situation? I'd be concerned about holding up the traffic!

I'm not overly bothered about it as I don't travel a lot at the moment (no work, lockdown)...

 

[Mark Holmes]

Thanks for sharing the detials. I've only ever got over 4Kwh once, and even driving like I'm driving Miss Daisy still doesn't usually yield that. I accelerate with the flow of the traffic, which is often that quick, does everyone else accelratevery slowly in this situation? I'd be concerned about holding up the traffic!

I'm not overly bothered about it as I don't travel a lot at the moment (no work, lockdown)...

I accelerate steadily as that’s where most of the initial power consumption is used getting off the line, but I certainly don’t hold the traffic up....

 

[seasidersrus27]

Yes the BMS update according to the forum on Monday has been acknowledged by MG and has been pulled for the time; hopefully it will be corrected soon. My car still won’t charge unlocked on a home charger and therefore I deduce mine doesn’t have this update at present. I’m sure it will be rectified soon; how are you enjoying the car to drive?

New Poster here. I had a scheduled 1styear service at Brown & Gammons MG in Baldock yesterday for my ZS EV and can confirm that the BMS update has been pulled by MG so was not done. It was the first i'd heard of the issue (hence my investigation of the forum - very useful resource thanks guys). The dealership said that MG were aware of and looking into issues with range and to check back with them "in a couple of weeks" for an update of when it might be re-issued. For reference - my car had been averaging 4.1 m/KWh in summer and has been at 3.1 m/KWh since the cold weather, without the BMS update.

 

[Mark Holmes]

New Poster here. I had a scheduled 1styear service at Brown & Gammons MG in Baldock yesterday for my ZS EV and can confirm that the BMS update has been pulled by MG so was not done. It was the first i'd heard of the issue (hence my investigation of the forum - very useful resource thanks guys). The dealership said that MG were aware of and looking into issues with range and to check back with them "in a couple of weeks" for an update of when it might be re-issued. For reference - my car had been averaging 4.1 m/KWh in summer and has been at 3.1 m/KWh since the cold weather, without the BMS update.

Welcome to the forum and I’m glad you find it useful, have you seen the Monday night live podcasts??

 

[Jake]

I wasn't sure whether to start a new thread or not with this niggling concern I have that is growing, but it is associated with Coldgate/range issues. The more I read about these BMS issues I can't help wondering what it was the tech guys were trying to achieve when they managed to screw up the full charge range. Do they have long term doubt over the capacity of the HV battery and fear a flood of warranty claims after a couple more winters? I have just pulled an extract from a current marketing page on a dealers site and copied it below. Note they are getting confused with motor power and battery capacity but the range claims are very optimistic.

I love the car so I'm hoping there are not going to be any long term issues. I currently have the pre-unlocked BMS version and quite happy with that so very reluctant to be upgraded without good cause. I work on the principle of "if it ain't broke don't try and fix it". Anybody got any theories or educated guesses as to what the underlying problem is they are trying to fix?

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[Mark Holmes]

Yes I think they are confused, but they should perhaps give winter and summer condition comparables moving forwards. I don’t have the BMS update either but the 2 degrees yesterday made a big difference from my last longer run when it was about 10 degrees and that again to my summer driving range. Moving forwards with this being my first EV and I love this car, I will look to remove about 40 miles for winter driving and base the purchase of my next car whenever that will be on this factor.

 

[seasidersrus27]

Welcome to the forum and I’m glad you find it useful, have you seen the Monday night live podcasts??

Yes- spotted those too

 

[Mgkev]

The EV-database-uk website recons 125 miles winter highway driving and Byorn Nyland suggests 110 in one of his YouTube videos. He also states that he believes the MG is very juicy in winter months.

 

[Cocijo]

Thanks for sharing the detials. I've only ever got over 4Kwh once, and even driving like I'm driving Miss Daisy still doesn't usually yield that. I accelerate with the flow of the traffic, which is often that quick, does everyone else accelratevery slowly in this situation? I'd be concerned about holding up the traffic!

I'm not overly bothered about it as I don't travel a lot at the moment (no work, lockdown)...

I really think that you should enjoy driving your EV and not worry too much about gentle acceleration and constantly be looking at range and consumption. The bottom line is that the car has a relatively small battery for it’s size. If the relatively limited range doesn’t suit your lifestyle then it may not be the car for you. Trying to squeeze more range out of the car I think detracts from the enjoyment of ownership. Personally, I’m fine with it, but if I was regularly doing longer trips it wouldn’t work for me. I drive the car normally and enjoy how it feels. I don’t wrap up in warm clothes, or freeze with minimum heating. I have air conditioning on when i need it and heated seats. I tend to accept that in winter i have a usable range of just over 100 miles. In warmer weather perhaps 140 miles.