Faulty battery

[Frank]

Ok, I will concede less damaging, but the fact remains that you have to charge the car, as you quoted, fact.

Nothing I said was misinformation. What is worse on this forum is the fear and dread about the condition of the battery taking away the enjoyment of EV cars.

It's a tool a car, use it and enjoy it without being over concerned about the state of one component of the car unnecessarily.

The car industry cannot even agree on the degradation rate of EV batteries (other than the use of RAPID chargers). They seem to suggest that 3% a year is the going average so with that rate in mind it will take 10 years to reach the warranty threshold but most people will have changed cars by then especially once newer battery technologically arrives. SSD batteries in particular will be a game changer.

If I was starting out on the EV route all the scary battery posts would concern me. Enjoy the car and let the BMS and warranty deal with the battery.

 

[C6MFC]

Only just found this thread but "Hear Hear" Frank to your posts

 

[MGBok]

My car went in twice to MG. they update software say problem solved but after I use rapid charge same happens again.
It is ok with slow charge.
MG haven’t given me any report on both times i when taken it in to be checked.

what could be problem?
I go away on holiday in a week

Hi
Yes I have had this on a rapid, was surprised when the charger switch off at 95% but thought no more then when I tried to start it go the same error message.
I trawled this forum and came across someone else saying that it did this at the same level (95%) and the general advice was give it 10 mins to cool down as it had overheated. I waited and sure enough it corrected itself.
This is why I didnt go for the new Leaf because of the overheating so bit miffed the MG may have a similar issue. In future Ill just charge to 90% and stop

 

[MGBok]

Hi
Yes I have had this on a rapid, was surprised when the charger switch off at 95% but thought no more then when I tried to start it go the same error message.
I trawled this forum and came across someone else saying that it did this at the same level (95%) and the general advice was give it 10 mins to cool down as it had overheated. I waited and sure enough it corrected itself.
This is why I didnt go for the new Leaf because of the overheating so bit miffed the MG may have a similar issue. In future Ill just charge to 90% and stop

 

[Lovemyev]

Hi
Yes I have had this on a rapid, was surprised when the charger switch off at 95% but thought no more then when I tried to start it go the same error message.
I trawled this forum and came across someone else saying that it did this at the same level (95%) and the general advice was give it 10 mins to cool down as it had overheated. I waited and sure enough it corrected itself.
This is why I didnt go for the new Leaf because of the overheating so bit miffed the MG may have a similar issue. In future Ill just charge to 90% and stop

Do we dare to make the assumption ( the killer of all ) that heat is the primary problem here folks ?.
As leaving the car for 10 mins and returning appears to resolve the issue.
If so, then is it fair to come to the conclusion I guess.
If this theory IS anything close to the real problem here, then it is a little surprising given that the car has built in cooling for the pack don’t you not think ?.
Maybe an option would be to have the cooling of the pack commence a little earlier then.
A simple software fix maybe ????.
I know some people may need to charge close to 100% from a rapid on times, but it’s the extra time factor for me that would dissuade me from carrying out this practice.
People who frequent rapids on a REGULAR basis, need to be getting to their destination in a hurry, like yesterday !.
As we know, a rapid will start to throttle back the charge significantly when it reaches about 80%.
So most people in a hurry is likely to end the charge session here in order to get under way again ASAP.
Sitting on the rapid waiting for the SOC to increase from 80% to close to 100% is going to take WAY too long for our people in a hurry and is expensive, IF you are paying for it that is.
Therefore people who are commonly using rapids know this and are unlikely to come across this issue of waiting for the car to cool down, before being able to leave.
I openly admit NOT to be a big user of rapid units myself, but I would not be charging above 80% for the reasons stated above.
Speaking purely for myself here, if I was using a rapid charger on almost a daily basis, then I would be questioning myself on the choice of EV that I had made.
A longer range EV would be my next focus.
Bashing the HV pack day in, day out with ALL that juice from a rapids IS going to effect the long term longevity.
On this point, I think we all agree.
If you car is on a least deal or even a PCP to a certain extent, and you intend to replace it at the end of the term, then the SOH of the battery will not be high in your list of priorities.
You are passing on the battery degradation to the next owner.
Manufacturers a fairly certain that they will not be replacing expensive HV packs under the warranty period.
An estimated degradation of about 3% per year ( given the usage and charging cycles ) is to be expected IMO.
Quick “Man Maths” themselves say that at this level, packs are likely going to last the life of the car.
Remember, even when the battery has badly degraded, it will not be the whole pack that is affected, just certain number of the individual cells that would need replacing.
Early Nissan Leaf are having their packs refurbished for a LOT less than the price of a complete HV pack.
When choosing an EV it maybe wise to factor in a bit of battery degradation IF you intend to keep the car long term and your daily usage pattern is likely to be stretching the range of the car when you first purchased it.
Otherwise you are likely to be making a few more charging stops as the pack ages.
The charging infrastructure is getting better, it HAS too !.
In another 3 to 5 years I expect to see a bug increase in chargers.
But you have to factor in the time you need to spend using them as your battery degradation increases and your demand for range has not reduced.
This only affects people who are covering a LOT of miles and performs a LOT of charging sessions.
Home charging is generally accepted as being kinder to the health of your battery pack long term.
Which comes a no big surprise to a lot of folks.

 

[LeoRBK]

Do we dare to make the assumption ( the killer of all ) that heat is the primary problem here folks ?.
As leaving the car for 10 mins and returning appears to resolve the issue.
If so, then is it fair to come to the conclusion I guess.
If this theory IS anything close to the real problem here, then it is a little surprising given that the car has built in cooling for the pack don’t you not think ?.
Maybe an option would be to have the cooling of the pack commence a little earlier then.
A simple software fix maybe ????.

My guess is that 10 mins is the time for the fault error code to auto-reset.
I agree that MG could improve the SW to avoid a fault, as you suggested it could either cool aggressively or throttle down charge rate or a mix of both.
I am sure there are cars with either better SW or more helpful messages, while some might stop charging abruptly.
I for one would like MG to provide a way to limit charge rate and charge cut-off percentage in the infotainment. I have seen it on some other car, maybe it was Kia eNiro...

 

[Kithmo]

We haven't charged the 5 yet on a rapid, but the one time I did with the ZS last year, the cooling fan came on seconds after I plugged into the CCS. The battery was well warmed up at the time, it was a warm day and we had covered about 120 miles with a 3 hour break.
Does the cooling fan come on as quick on the 5 ?

 

[Lovemyev]

I for one would like MG to provide a way to limit charge rate and charge cut-off percentage in the infotainment. I have seen it on some other car, maybe it was Kia eNiro...

I think there is a number of EV’s that will allow you to set an upper % limit on what you would like to charge your car up to.
Either by an App or from the head unit in the car at least.
Even my previous 2015 VW PHEV could be have the upper charge limit % set from the head unit.
The only way I have managed to achieving how much charge as a % into the car at home, is buy taking a note of range when placing on charge, then the dash panel will display a given time to reach 100% full charged.
As a rule, for every hour the car spends on charge from a 7 kw wall box, you are adding roughly about 25 miles of range to your battery.
I have installed a Wi-Fi relay inside of my dumb Rolec unit and also an App on my phone.
This will allow me the opportunity to carry out timed control, over the wall box.
I really wanted this facility to take advantage of cheaper off peak rates.
I can get pretty close to the level of charge I want to put into the battery, by doing a bit of “Man Math’s” and then set the timer function on the App.
Not the best solution, but at least it does offer SOME control of how when and much charge I want to put into the HV battery.
It has been hinted, that the face lift longer range ZS EV that is due for release towards the end of 2021 will have an App included.
Of course this is just purely speculation at the moment.
After the criticism the original ZS EV received due to the lack of control with regards to timed charging functions.
Surely they have made SOME provision on the newer model ????.
Silly to make the same mistake TWICE you would think .

 

[Petriix]

Ok, I will concede less damaging, but the fact remains that you have to charge the car, as you quoted, fact.

Nothing I said was misinformation. What is worse on this forum is the fear and dread about the condition of the battery taking away the enjoyment of EV cars.

It's a tool a car, use it and enjoy it without being over concerned about the state of one component of the car unnecessarily.

The car industry cannot even agree on the degradation rate of EV batteries (other than the use of RAPID chargers). They seem to suggest that 3% a year is the going average so with that rate in mind it will take 10 years to reach the warranty threshold but most people will have changed cars by then especially once newer battery technologically arrives. SSD batteries in particular will be a game changer.

If I was starting out on the EV route all the scary battery posts would concern me. Enjoy the car and let the BMS and warranty deal with the battery.

I've not seen any 'fear and dread', just factual information to enable people to make a choice about how to get the best out of their EV. Many people prefer the simplicity of the 'plug in and forget' approach. Some of us prefer to be a little more involved.

It's entirely reasonable to point out that you can take steps to minimise degradation if you want to. What bothers me is when people make statements like: 'charging to full every night won't do any harm'. I'm OK with 'it's easier to just charge to full and I'm not worried about slightly increased degradation'. I hope you can see the difference.

I do enjoy the car. But MG haven't got a great history of writing good BMS software. In any case there is no harm in being more thorough if that suits you.

 

[Petriix]

Do we dare to make the assumption ( the killer of all ) that heat is the primary problem here folks ?.
As leaving the car for 10 mins and returning appears to resolve the issue.
If so, then is it fair to come to the conclusion I guess.
If this theory IS anything close to the real problem here, then it is a little surprising given that the car has built in cooling for the pack don’t you not think ?.
Maybe an option would be to have the cooling of the pack commence a little earlier then.
A simple software fix maybe ????.
I know some people may need to charge close to 100% from a rapid on times, but it’s the extra time factor for me that would dissuade me from carrying out this practice.
People who frequent rapids on a REGULAR basis, need to be getting to their destination in a hurry, like yesterday !.
As we know, a rapid will start to throttle back the charge significantly when it reaches about 80%.
So most people in a hurry is likely to end the charge session here in order to get under way again ASAP.
Sitting on the rapid waiting for the SOC to increase from 80% to close to 100% is going to take WAY too long for our people in a hurry and is expensive, IF you are paying for it that is.
Therefore people who are commonly using rapids know this and are unlikely to come across this issue of waiting for the car to cool down, before being able to leave.
I openly admit NOT to be a big user of rapid units myself, but I would not be charging above 80% for the reasons stated above.
Speaking purely for myself here, if I was using a rapid charger on almost a daily basis, then I would be questioning myself on the choice of EV that I had made.
A longer range EV would be my next focus.
Bashing the HV pack day in, day out with ALL that juice from a rapids IS going to effect the long term longevity.
On this point, I think we all agree.
If you car is on a least deal or even a PCP to a certain extent, and you intend to replace it at the end of the term, then the SOH of the battery will not be high in your list of priorities.
You are passing on the battery degradation to the next owner.
Manufacturers a fairly certain that they will not be replacing expensive HV packs under the warranty period.
An estimated degradation of about 3% per year ( given the usage and charging cycles ) is to be expected IMO.
Quick “Man Maths” themselves say that at this level, packs are likely going to last the life of the car.
Remember, even when the battery has badly degraded, it will not be the whole pack that is affected, just certain number of the individual cells that would need replacing.
Early Nissan Leaf are having their packs refurbished for a LOT less than the price of a complete HV pack.
When choosing an EV it maybe wise to factor in a bit of battery degradation IF you intend to keep the car long term and your daily usage pattern is likely to be stretching the range of the car when you first purchased it.
Otherwise you are likely to be making a few more charging stops as the pack ages.
The charging infrastructure is getting better, it HAS too !.
In another 3 to 5 years I expect to see a bug increase in chargers.
But you have to factor in the time you need to spend using them as your battery degradation increases and your demand for range has not reduced.
This only affects people who are covering a LOT of miles and performs a LOT of charging sessions.
Home charging is generally accepted as being kinder to the health of your battery pack long term.
Which comes a no big surprise to a lot of folks.

I think that heat is likely to be a red herring here. My guess would be that there is a bug with how the car communicates to the charger that the charging rate should drop at around the 94% mark. This then causes an error which must be handled by the charger and/or the car. The car's fallback is to shut off the HV battery and have its 10 minute tantrum before it will reset as if nothing has happened.

I suspect a software update could fix it, but first MG would need to acknowledge that the problem exists.

 

[Lovemyev]

I think that heat is likely to be a red herring here. My guess would be that there is a bug with how the car communicates to the charger that the charging rate should drop at around the 94% mark. This then causes an error which must be handled by the charger and/or the car. The car's fallback is to shut off the HV battery and have its 10 minute tantrum before it will reset as if nothing has happened.

I suspect a software update could fix it, but first MG would need to acknowledge that the problem exists.

Yeah - I can see where you are coming from !.
Maybe a touch of both things going on - who knows .

 

[RoadUser]

On a similar note I've noticed a couple of times using 22KW A/C chargers, the battery stops before 60%. Anyone else come across this on a 22KW or even 11KW, which I believe is 3 phase; however I was using the usual single phase 32A cable.

 

[5teep]

Weird, it shouldn't matter what power the ac post is as all it's doing is supplying power to the onboard charger.

 

[Les burrows]

On a similar note I've noticed a couple of times using 22KW A/C chargers, the battery stops before 60%. Anyone else come across this on a 22KW or even 11KW, which I believe is 3 phase; however I was using the usual single phase 32A cable.

No idea why this should happen as the car only as a 7kw onboard charger fitted so even if it’s 22 or 11kw post you plug into the car will only draw 7KW on AC but on DC it can draw 50kw I think this is the same for both the ZS and MG5 series 1 but the long range Series 2 I believe as an11KW AC and a 100 KW DC built in it below is part of an article from ZAP-MAPs all about charging the full article can be read at

MG 5 EV EV charging guide - Zapmap

Guide to charge your 5 EV. Zapmap's MG 5 EV charging guide will help you get the most from your electric car.

www.zap-map.com

Les

How long does it take to charge an MG5 EV?​

The following table shows approximate time to charge an MG5 EV. Times are for a 100% charge for all but rapid charging, which is quoted for 0-80% as most rapid chargers reduce or cut power well before 100% charge to protect the battery and maximise efficiency.

Note that the times shown are only a guide, as very rarely will an EV need to be fully charged from 0%. Other factors that might vary the charging time include ambient temperature, in-vehicle energy loads, any upper and lower charge restrictions to extend battery life and protect against potential damage, and charging rates slowing down as the maximum charge is reached.

Rapid 50kW	Fast 22kW	Fast 7kW	Slow 3kW
50 minutes 0-80%	8.5 hours 0-100%	8.5 hours 0-100%	15 hours 0-100%

The MG5 EV is fitted with a 7 kW on-board charger for Type 2 AC charging as standard, in addition to rapid 50 kW DC capability. This means that even when connected to a fast charger with a rated output above 7 kW, the MG5 EV will only be able to charge at 7 kW.

 

[biffo]

I think talk of 100kW charging on MG5 Long Range is a bit of marketing spin.

According to EV Database both Standard and Long do 6.6kW AC and 80kW DC. ZS EV is listed as 6.6kW AC and 76kW DC with an interesting graph here.

 

[5teep]

I'm pretty sure the series 1 MG5 can charge up to 80kw on a rapid.

 

[AdamMGEV]

So I just got a HV battery shut off message. I turned it on with my foot on the brake as usual and it just came up. Switched it off and back on again and it worked OK. Strange.

 

[Petriix]

@MilesperkWh do you know if MG has acknowledged the fault and if they're working on a fix?

 

[adnan nasir]

Hi I recently bought MG5EV my car is fully charged but the dashboard is still saying your car is charging which means I’m not able to use my car so I contact to the installer nothing wrong with charging station everything is fine with that but I don’t everything many time on and off but I still same problem is there anybody also has the same problem please update thank you

 

[Deleted member 7171]

Hi

Was it charged with a home charger or not?

If not was it a rapid charge, a fast charge or a slow charge?

Try plugging the car in the charger again then start a charge, end the charge, unplug the car and try to start the car again.

If that fails try disconnecting the the 12 volt battery then after 10 mins reconnect the 12 volt and try to start the car.

For hints on 12 volt issues.



Let us know how you get on.