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Haven't bought one...yet

MrG

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Evening all,

First post from me! We are ready to ditch our 2009 Fiesta and enter the new world of electric vehicles. It's quite daunting as I know very little about cars at all, and rely largely on what I read...which isn't the best way to decide if I should shell out thousands of pounds for a car!

Our budget is £20,000 and a second hand MG ZS EV (preferably Exclusive model!) is really coming top of the list for me at the moment. I have to wait for showrooms to open again before I can have a test drive but I wanted to do a bit of EV homework before committing to the car.

To begin with, can anyone advise the preferred home charging system you would opt for? I keep reading something about 'Granny Chargers'? Is that where the charger plugs directly into a plug socket? Then, I also read that the charging system should be wired directly to the fuse box. That shouldn't be a huge problem but then I read that slow charging (via Granny??) is better than rapid charging (via fuse box??). We are currently with Scottish Power, but is Octopus the preferred choice for EV users?

As you can see, this is going to take a while, so best I start asking my questions now...!!

Thank you all, in advance.
 
Yes a granny charger has a 13amp plug and takes an eternity 20+ hrs to charge .a 7kw charger is a must really .mine is a BP chargemaster ,never had any problems ,but not had it that long .as far as all the ev jargon goes ,its a minefield at first but you very quickly pick it all up mpkw instead of mpg etc .once it clicks it makes sense
 
Please note the following with Regards to charging EV (basically covers ALL EV,s). There are there three different categories of charging speeds (ie how quickly you can get your battery up to a full charge (or whatever you need to complete a journey, ie how much fuel you need to go a certain distance. Electricity is just a fuel like Diesel or Petrol, if you need to travel x distance then you need x amount of Electricity, Petrol or Diesel to go a certain distance.

I have digressed a bit, the three categories are: Slow, Fast and Rapid. There are no others. The output of a charger is expressed in Kwh(or Kw, I can't remember or care really) and the higher the figure the quicker you can charge the battery. It means kilowatt per hour. EV come in different battery sizes (just like Petrol or Diesel cars have different size fuel tanks. You need to know what size battery you have to determine how long to charge it will take. The MG ZS has a 44 kwh battery. So simple maths. If empty it will take over 11 hours to fully charge if using a Slow Charger (44 divided by 3) you get the gist.



These are approximate figures, but up to 3 Kwh/Kw output is Slow and will take on average over 13 hours to charge a battery from empty to full so in summary forget Slow chargers they are as much use as a chocolate fire guard. An example of a slow charger is the charger that plugs into ANY plug socket. These chargers come with most EV and are only designed to be used if you have not got access to a Fast or Rapid Charger, commonly called Granny Chargers (but offensive to Grannys as I know a lot of Grannys who are anything but slow)

Fast chargers run at about 7Kwh and the best example is a home charger and it connects to the main circuit board. It will take about 6 hours to charge your MG ZS from empty to full.

Rapid chargers are basically anything above 7Kwh and can to up to outputs of nearly 300Kwh. Rapid chargers are mainly only found outside on the public charging infrastructure. They can be fitted in domestic household but are expensive and more importantly need a 3 Phase AC supply which almost all domestic households do NOT have.

Important points:-

Slow charging should only be used until you get a home charger installed. It puts a huge strain on the socket due to the current being drawn and some sockets can't cope with it, keep a note of the temp of the socket (it will get warm but hopefully not hot, so keep a watch on this).

Fast charging with a home charger is the most sensible way to operate an EV. People unlucky enough not to be able to install a Home Charger (no off road parking or live in flats) will find it very inconvenient to run an EV and are usually dependent on using the public charging infrastructure to charge their vehicles. I plug my car in EVERY night regardless of charge so I have a full tank every morning just in case of that unexpected journey.

Now here's a problem Rapid Charging is not good for an EV battery and if one always charges using Rapid Chargers their battery will not last as long as an EV that mainly used Slow or Fast Chargers. However if you are using your EV for travel outside of its range you will HAVE to use Rapid chargers as the other chargers will take too long. Example your EV can travel 150 miles in one charge and your journey is 250 miles you will have to charge at least once during that trip. Drive 130 miles and you will need to put in enough charge to make the rest of the journey. So you need to put in enough charge to travel the remaining 70 miles. Rather than working in gallons needed, EV work in percentage to battery capacity. A full tank (battery) is 100%, and most EV show the battery capacity remaining to help the user work out their charging requirements. You need to know your own vehicles potential range from a full charge to help you work out the maths just the same as you would do with an petrol or Diesel cars Potential MPG . The MG ZS can safely do about 130 before you would need to charge and you would likely have used about 70% of the battery capacity. So you have arrived at the charger and you need to work out what you need, you have 30% in the tank already and you need to travel another 80 miles before getting to your next destination which could be home, another charging stop or destination, so you need to work out the percentage you will need to get the battery up to to complete your journey. Rapid chargers will only give a EV what it will take. A system on EVs called the Battery Management System (BMS)communicates with the charger and tells it what to give the vehicle. All EV s takes different charge rates and the MG can ONLY take a maximum of 80Kwh but only occasionally as unfortunately the BMS wants to protect the Battery life and in normal charging you would only be taking about 40Kwh on average and when the battery gets to 80% charge the BMS really throttles back the charging to that of a slow charge at about 3Kwh. This is why you read in EV handbooks always only quote the time it takes to charge from empty to 80% and not to 100%. You can charge to 100% on a Rapid Charger it's just that it will take longer to get from 80-100% due to the BMS protecting the battery. Unless There is others waiting to use the Rapid charger or I am pushed for time I ALWAYS charge to 100% to make the working out easier plus having a full tank again helps keep range anxiety at bay.

There is also another major difference between Slow/Fast and Rapid charging. Rapid is Direct Current charging that goes directly to the battery which creates a lot of heat in the battery and that is why the BMS cuts in. The other speeds are AC charging and go from the charger via the cars on board AC Charger which converts it to DC and then goes to the battery. All EVs do have on board AC chargers but are not the same size, the MG has a 7 Kwh and therefore when using AC charging from whatever source it will only take a maximum of 7kwh. An easy way to determine what type of charging you are giving the MG is that if you are only using the top part of charging port it is AC, if using all of the charging port then it is DC.

So in summary, Slow and Fast are ONLY good for overnight charging and is the best healthwise for the battery. Rapid should ONLY be used when you have to keep costs down, STAY away from the Public Charging where possible as it vastly more expensive than charging at home. However in saying that there are free chargers around but mainly only up to Fast charging speeds so to be any use you would have to be plugged in for at least over an hour to make it worthwhile.

Finally, a LOT of EV drivers over concern themselves with their batteries (in my opinion) and have a charging regime, don't charge to 100% , don't let the charge get too low and so on. Bollocks to that, the BMS won't let the car get too low and it will also not let it charge to 100% either. The car will tell you it has charged to 100%, but it has not and NEVER will charge to 100% and when it might be indicating 0% on the battery , it isn't. The BMS leaves a margin top and bottom to protect the battery , beside you have an 80000 mile warranty on the battery, so you do NOT NEED A charging regime, unless you worry about that sort of thing. Plug it in EVERY night before settling in, and have the reassurance of having a full tank every morning.
 
Evening all,

First post from me! We are ready to ditch our 2009 Fiesta and enter the new world of electric vehicles. It's quite daunting as I know very little about cars at all, and rely largely on what I read...which isn't the best way to decide if I should shell out thousands of pounds for a car!

Our budget is £20,000 and a second hand MG ZS EV (preferably Exclusive model!) is really coming top of the list for me at the moment. I have to wait for showrooms to open again before I can have a test drive but I wanted to do a bit of EV homework before committing to the car.

To begin with, can anyone advise the preferred home charging system you would opt for? I keep reading something about 'Granny Chargers'? Is that where the charger plugs directly into a plug socket? Then, I also read that the charging system should be wired directly to the fuse box. That shouldn't be a huge problem but then I read that slow charging (via Granny??) is better than rapid charging (via fuse box??). We are currently with Scottish Power, but is Octopus the preferred choice for EV users?

As you can see, this is going to take a while, so best I start asking my questions now...!!

Thank you all, in advance.
Welcome. I can thoroughly recommend an MG ZS EV as your first leap to EV driving. Your budget of £20k is not far short of new prices being offered still by some dealers so shop around. The Exclusive is the one to go for if you can stretch to it. Unless you do a huge mileage I wouldn't worry too much about electricity costs just yet as whatever you pay will be considerably less than your petrol costs. Definitely go for a 7kW home charger and then monitor your usage over the first few months while comparing various tariffs to suit your life style. If your annual mileage is around 8,000 then you are looking at less than £300 year tops and significantly less if you chase the tariffs so don't worry too much. The depreciation of the car is far greater.

As for a charging strategy you need to think ahead a little more than being able to pop to the petrol station whenever you need. As has been said plug in overnight knowing you have a full 'tank' for the next day or once a week according to your usage but never leave yourself too low just incase you have an unplanned journey.

Whatever you decide I'm sure you'll be amazed how easy EV driving is and never look back. I haven't been to a petrol station for over 4 years and love it.

You won't get better value for money than the MG EVs at the moment. Go for it and good luck.
 
Welcome. I can thoroughly recommend an MG ZS EV as your first leap to EV driving. Your budget of £20k is not far short of new prices being offered still by some dealers so shop around. The Exclusive is the one to go for if you can stretch to it. Unless you do a huge mileage I wouldn't worry too much about electricity costs just yet as whatever you pay will be considerably less than your petrol costs. Definitely go for a 7kW home charger and then monitor your usage over the first few months while comparing various tariffs to suit your life style. If your annual mileage is around 8,000 then you are looking at less than £300 year tops and significantly less if you chase the tariffs so don't worry too much. The depreciation of the car is far greater.

As for a charging strategy you need to think ahead a little more than being able to pop to the petrol station whenever you need. As has been said plug in overnight knowing you have a full 'tank' for the next day or once a week according to your usage but never leave yourself too low just incase you have an unplanned journey.

Whatever you decide I'm sure you'll be amazed how easy EV driving is and never look back. I haven't been to a petrol station for over 4 years and love it.

You won't get better value for money than the MG EVs at the moment. Go for it and good luck.
Totally agree as this is my first EV and my ZS EV is brilliant and I’m even more amazed about the quality and drive for the money compared to many much more expensive options. Really happy I test drove and bought this car.
 
As @Jake says there are quite a few new exclusives just north of 20K (Vic Youngs in South Shields seem to consistently be the cheapest, but even in 50 miles of London, dealers are doing them for £21.5 which seems to be par for the course at the moment, I'm not sure how Vic Youngs sell theirs at 1K less than everyone else). If you do end up buying at distance, check out the feedback on dealers on the dealer sub-forum to get a sense of who is a good one to go with. New & Used Cars for Sale - Auto Trader UK (this autotrader search will only return new models (not pre-reg) in the Exclusive trim)
 
As @Jake says there are quite a few new exclusives just north of 20K (Vic Youngs in South Shields seem to consistently be the cheapest, but even in 50 miles of London, dealers are doing them for £21.5 which seems to be par for the course at the moment, I'm not sure how Vic Youngs sell theirs at 1K less than everyone else). If you do end up buying at distance, check out the feedback on dealers on the dealer sub-forum to get a sense of who is a good one to go with. New & Used Cars for Sale - Auto Trader UK (this autotrader search will only return new models (not pre-reg) in the Exclusive trim)
I’m gutted at the current prices as I was really pleased with the deal I got, but these are even better value for money than ever before...
 
My dealer offered me £17K in part chop against an MG5, Which I thought was a bit mean, I thought £20 would be near the mark. Its top of the range and cost about 26 and is not yet year old...with 6k miles on the clock.
If there is a series 2 coming out, with better range....mine could be available.

I though the MG5 a fine car, with good range.....but us old farts need all the safety features going.....and MG5 was missing too many of them for my liking.
 
Octopus is often first choice for EV drivers mainly because they have three smart tariffs which are great for drivers.
1. Agile - "roulette of electricity prices". Prices change each 30mins, and prices can go negative sometimes (octopus pays you to charge). Prices for the next day is published around 4pm. However britxit and weather has impacted price on this tariff for the last 2 months. With clever usage people have got single figure average p values. It takes work to make this tariff pay off so the other two are simpler.
2. Go - 5p between 0.30am to 4.30am. (South wales 14.02p outside the period).
3. Go Faster - 3, 4 or 5 hour window, with a start time between 20:30 and 03:30, 4.5p (3h)/5p (4h)/5.5p (5h). You have to ask or be invited onto this tariff and the window is selected by octopus. Outside the window the same price as Go 14.02p (South wales).
Also before you sign up to octopus, get someone's referral code. You get £50, the other person gets £50.
 
And you get an octopus stuffy!
 

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My dealer offered me £17K in part chop against an MG5, Which I thought was a bit mean, I thought £20 would be near the mark. Its top of the range and cost about 26 and is not yet year old...with 6k miles on the clock.
If there is a series 2 coming out, with better range....mine could be available.

I though the MG5 a fine car, with good range.....but us old farts need all the safety features going.....and MG5 was missing too many of them for my liking.
Yeah that’s being a bit tight on the trade in price, I’d rather go to a private sale for that price. Dread to think what they’d offer me with just under 14,000 miles now....
 
Octopus is often first choice for EV drivers mainly because they have three smart tariffs which are great for drivers.
1. Agile - "roulette of electricity prices". Prices change each 30mins, and prices can go negative sometimes (octopus pays you to charge). Prices for the next day is published around 4pm. However britxit and weather has impacted price on this tariff for the last 2 months. With clever usage people have got single figure average p values. It takes work to make this tariff pay off so the other two are simpler.
2. Go - 5p between 0.30am to 4.30am. (South wales 14.02p outside the period).
3. Go Faster - 3, 4 or 5 hour window, with a start time between 20:30 and 03:30, 4.5p (3h)/5p (4h)/5.5p (5h). You have to ask or be invited onto this tariff and the window is selected by octopus. Outside the window the same price as Go 14.02p (South wales).
Also before you sign up to octopus, get someone's referral code. You get £50, the other person gets £50.
I’m still with EDF Go Electric on a flat rate of 11.70p per KWh across the board, this is only until May and I can already see the prices have increased substantially..daily rate 29.03p
 
A car that’s heavily discounted when new generally has impacted residual values later down the line. Any new car usually takes a big hit. It’s a bit early to say how the ZS EV will perform. EV’s generally seem to hold up reasonably well. 50% over 3 Years/40,000 miles for the ZS?
 
My dealer offered me £17K in part chop against an MG5, Which I thought was a bit mean, I thought £20 would be near the mark. Its top of the range and cost about 26 and is not yet year old...with 6k miles on the clock.
If there is a series 2 coming out, with better range....mine could be available.

I though the MG5 a fine car, with good range.....but us old farts need all the safety features going.....and MG5 was missing too many of them for my liking.
Sounds bang on the money to me for a trade valuation - if a pre-registered one with delivery mileage is available for £20,500 nobody’s going to pay that for one with 6k on the clock, it’s retail price will need to be less.

Its always been extremely expensive to change a car after such a short period of time.
 
A car that’s heavily discounted when new generally has impacted residual values later down the line. Any new car usually takes a big hit. It’s a bit early to say how the ZS EV will perform. EV’s generally seem to hold up reasonably well. 50% over 3 Years/40,000 miles for the ZS?
The GFV on manufacturer PCP will be a decent prediction of this - just under £10k at four years I believe. Of course retail prices might not drop that low given the desireability of a sub-£15k electric SUV with some warranty left.
 
Sounds bang on the money to me for a trade valuation - if a pre-registered one with delivery mileage is available for £20,500 nobody’s going to pay that for one with 6k on the clock, it’s retail price will need to be less.

Its always been extremely expensive to change a car after such a short period of time.
Yes that makes sense, but let’s hope they get rid of this cheap stock and start getting the prices back up to where they were originally otherwise some will really suffer with depreciation value, I would expect 5k in year one but some are losing more I would think..🤔
 
The GFV on manufacturer PCP will be a decent prediction of this - just under £10k at four years I believe. Of course retail prices might not drop that low given the desireability of a sub-£15k electric SUV with some warranty left.
Let’s hope so..
 
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