Octopus Energy - Sharing my Prices and thoughts - January 2023 onwards…

But in this case there is a regulator charged with managing prices. Our electricity market is dysfunctional because everyone gets the price of the highest bidder to supply. Electricity was also taxed for its carbon output. That has been removed and should be placed on gas. It is in the country’s interest to get energy prices down to be competitive. That will impact inflation acr goods and services across the country but it is the businesses without scrutiny that will gouge prices.
 
Absolutely with you there @Cocijo.

The inflated energy prices are a major contributor to inflation in all other prices but I also don't see electricity prices dropping back quite as far as @BrianG in his magnificent (and nicely optimistic) post, but wouldn't it be good if they did!! :)

Anyway, as well as the companies holding onto increased margins after the prices fall, I can't imagine many of the workforce who successfully use inflation as a factor in pay negotiation will give back any it even if prices drop significantly.
 
Absolutely with you there @Cocijo.

The inflated energy prices are a major contributor to inflation in all other prices but I also don't see electricity prices dropping back quite as far as @BrianG in his magnificent (and nicely optimistic) post, but wouldn't it be good if they did!! :)

Anyway, as well as the companies holding onto increased margins after the prices fall, I can't imagine many of the workforce who successfully use inflation as a factor in pay negotiation will give back any it even if prices drop significantly.
Well the cfds for most of the wind farms currently being built are ~4p a kWh plus inflation from 2012 base year. Add distribution costs and retailers profit will come out at about 15p a kWh. By 2026 the ESO expects to turn off fossil fuel power stations. The current build at the above price includes Dogger Bank (4) total 5 GW. SeaGreen 1 and 1a 1.5 GW, NNG .45GW, Norfolk Vanguard and Boreas 4.2 GW, East and West Moray ~ 2 GW Hornsea 1,2 and 3 4 GW, Inchcape 1 GW, East Anglia hub 3.1 GW. Given that they get support if the price bid is lower than their cfd they have nothing to lose and like nuclear will sell at any price. These wind farms are all being built now, some only at the point of issuing contracts others well on the way to completion or newly completed. Wind is often generating 15 GW now and with an extra 16 GW should meet our needs for much of the windy season. Gas will support the grid up to the end of the decade, but unlike now where we are often asking CCGT to produce 10 GW which costs 20 GW of gas, our need for gas for electricity will be tiny.
 
Yes. It looks positive. The big challenge is still storage of the green generated electricity for distribution when needed.
We will face even bigger challenges for peak usage as electric cars start to become the norm.
All EV’s should now come as standard with the ability to act as a storage battery for use in the home and to draw from the grid and be also used as storage when needed.
 
We can already see efforts to move domestic demand to align better with production peaks, and this has been happening in industry for some time. It would be impossible to completely smooth demand but there's a lot can be done with not too much cost/effort.
 
We can already see efforts to move domestic demand to align better with production peaks, and this has been happening in industry for some time. It would be impossible to completely smooth demand but there's a lot can be done with not too much cost/effort.
I think that we have to think much more deeply about how electricity will be used in the future. Tata steel have already been seeking support for electrification of steel production. Their aging blast furnaces will need replacement in a few years time. The Swedes have already trialled ore reduction and steel making at post laboratory scale. It works, a mix of electric hearth furnaces blasted with hydrogen and small amounts of coking coal for introducing carbon into the steel have made good steel. Cement making is another industry to move from coal, brick making and glass making need to be electrified. All these processes can use the cheap overnight power. But we shouldn’t worry about cheap electricity for cars. Hydrogen for home heating is now kicked into touch by MPs. So daytime consumption will increase massively too.

In my rambling note earlier I posited how much wind power is on its way in the next 2-3 years. Again we shouldn’t look too closely at GB (sic) on its own. Our neighbours in Europe will also face intermittency so will be desperate to share highs and lows of power production. Ireland has just announced 7GW of development, just a start for they have great wind resources out in the west. The Dutch and the Danes want to fill their North Sea areas with turbines, the Germans will join in too. By 2030 Scotland might have added over 27GW over and above their current build. The Celtic Sea might add 7 or more GW and planned extensions to current English wind farms should add another 7 GW. Plus areas in Morecambe bay and new areas on the Dogger Bank might add 7 GW.

Norway has deep waters off its coast but is planning a lot of wind development, presumably their crown fund see it as a way of replacing oil revenues with electricity revenues. And I haven’t mentioned the plans to electrify oil production. I haven’t delved into it but presumably all the rigs and pumps out at sea gobble up gas which could be brought ashore. So the areas are mapped out as to where the oil industry should use wind power to electrify production. The potential power available is massive, but maybe too far from shore to exploit for the mainlands of Europe.

And costs will continue to fall. Much of the learning has been done costs for floating wind are high until the risks are fully known and production line techniques become the norm. The grid in particular will need a lot of costly upgrades, but it is now old and due for refurbishment in many places, in some places it is underused and where it needs reinforcement the costs will be recovered. Think it as an aeroplane, no good having it if it is not flying, the grid will be working harder over 24 hours a day, as will local networks so that unit costs per kWh should fall.

My household has moved from oil heating and diesel motoring to ASHP and EV. Our electricity consumption has increased from ~ 3,500 kWh to 10,500 kWh. Motoring has added about 1,200 kWh. Our ratio of day to night is about 50:50 on Intelligent Octopus tariff. Now retired but thinking back to when we were working our motoring would have demanded 5,000 kWh at its peak, not many people drive 18,000 miles a year for work!
 
Hi, I would like to just follow up on Cocijo's original post regarding Octopus rates. I am relatively new to Octopus after my original supplier folded like so many others and my account automatically transferred. Below are the rates (directly off my bill) I am paying on their Flexible Avro October 2021 v1 tarif.

Unit Rate (Day) 61.63p per kW/h
Unit Rate (Night) 25.69p per kW/h
Standing Charge 45.33p/day (£165.45/year)

Cocijo, these rates are way higher than what you gave in your original post, your numbers look more like what Octopus publish online now where the numbers reflect the rates AFTER the application of the energy price guarantee discount. Did your numbers include the discount?

Is anyone else with Octopus paying 61.63p per kWh (before discount) or is there a mistake with my account?
 
Hi, I would like to just follow up on Cocijo's original post regarding Octopus rates. I am relatively new to Octopus after my original supplier folded like so many others and my account automatically transferred. Below are the rates (directly off my bill) I am paying on their Flexible Avro October 2021 v1 tarif.

Unit Rate (Day) 61.63p per kW/h
Unit Rate (Night) 25.69p per kW/h
Standing Charge 45.33p/day (£165.45/year)

Cocijo, these rates are way higher than what you gave in your original post, your numbers look more like what Octopus publish online now where the numbers reflect the rates AFTER the application of the energy price guarantee discount. Did your numbers include the discount?

Is anyone else with Octopus paying 61.63p per kWh (before discount) or is there a mistake with my account?
I’m no expert on the Octopus tariffs, but I am on their Octopus Go tariff.
You should have an online account and be able to login and check your account rates etc.

The Octopus app is also quite useful.
The rates that I’ve quoted can be checked online with Octopus by entering your postcode.

If you have an EV and use around 30% of your electric on charging the car, the Go tariff works out better (for you with your quoted rates it looks like a must move if you can).

You seem to be on something completely different. Depending on your tariff the day rate that you have shown may be capped at around 34p/KwHr but you’ll need to speak to Octopus.

The Go tariff requires a smart meter, so if you don’t have one you can get Octopus to fit one for you. The Go tariff is now variable and not capped, so it can change, but you can move at any time if it doesn’t suit you.
 
Looks like a business tariff not subject to the cap? Phone them!

The Go tariff appears to be 12.5p overnight and around 40p day. But things might have changed.
 
Hi, I would like to just follow up on Cocijo's original post regarding Octopus rates. I am relatively new to Octopus after my original supplier folded like so many others and my account automatically transferred. Below are the rates (directly off my bill) I am paying on their Flexible Avro October 2021 v1 tarif.

Unit Rate (Day) 61.63p per kW/h
Unit Rate (Night) 25.69p per kW/h
Standing Charge 45.33p/day (£165.45/year)

Cocijo, these rates are way higher than what you gave in your original post, your numbers look more like what Octopus publish online now where the numbers reflect the rates AFTER the application of the energy price guarantee discount. Did your numbers include the discount?

Is anyone else with Octopus paying 61.63p per kWh (before discount) or is there a mistake with my account?
Might help if you mention your after subsidy prices for comparison. I too was with Avro but switched to Go once Octopus took over.
 
Thanks all for your replies, particularly Cocijo for a very comprehensive reply. Unfortunately Cocijo did not say if the prices he listed are before or after discount being applied. My tariff after the price cap discount is applied are:
Day 39.65p per kW/h
Night 15.57 per kW/h
but after April will revert to:
Day 61.63p per kW/h
Night 25.69p per kW/h
or more.
I am just trying to establish if my before/after tariffs are pretty much in line with others on a Flexible tariff. I do understand that most members on this forum will be on a Go tariff.
 
There’s no price cap on the Go tariff. It’s a variable tariff without price cap. As I mentioned you can exit it at short notice and go on another capped tariff if it doesn’t work out.
 
My Go tariff isn't variable
yes, you are correct. the Go tariff is fixed. I meant not capped but didn’t explain it that well/got it wrong I’m afraid. The variable tariff has price cap.
 
Thanks all for your replies, particularly Cocijo for a very comprehensive reply. Unfortunately Cocijo did not say if the prices he listed are before or after discount being applied. My tariff after the price cap discount is applied are:
Day 39.65p per kW/h
Night 15.57 per kW/h
but after April will revert to:
Day 61.63p per kW/h
Night 25.69p per kW/h
or more.
I am just trying to establish if my before/after tariffs are pretty much in line with others on a Flexible tariff. I do understand that most members on this forum will be on a Go tariff.
Those 'now' are in line for after subsidy tariffs but the April, well who knows what will happen between now and then with subsidies, so not really worth worrying about right now.
 
I just came across this thread when googling and just wanted to say to the OP that I've been on Intelligent Octopus with a PodPoint Solo home charger since March 2022!
 
I am on the Octopus Go Faster tariff and pay 8.25p kWh 21:30-02:30 then 40.04p kWh between 02:30 and 21:30 with a standing charge of ~40 p

I got the MG EV, Zappi and a 20kWh battery system all at the same time.

in my situation I finished a lease car and replaced it with the MG on lease for the same monthly price, so no capex cost.

I about 600 a month.

I work from home and use 17 kWh per day, 12 kWh from the batteries the other 5 kWh during cheap rate, ie just before going to bed start dishwasher, washing machine, dryer, bread maker etc etc.

I now have a 90l hot water tank that can be heated by gas or elec. I use 1.5kWh to heat up to 60c during cheap rate and top up from batteries another 1.5kWh about 2pm. The showers are all elec so don’t need a big water tank. Hot water costs me about £7.50 a month. I have been testing using the central heating system boiler to top up during the day as it is a
ready on and hot, but still at best 58% efficient so will probably keep using batteries to top up.


All but ~400 Wh per day is used at cheap rate, the 400Wh is the delta between what the batteries can deliver 4kWh and what the elec shower draws from the grid. Also I ‘donate’ 300Wh to grid each day as part of the battery/grid balancing act, I prefer to give 300Wh at 8.25p than buy 300Wh at 40.04p.

My old car cost 25p per mile in diesel, I am paying ~2.5p per mile for the MG.

At the current rates the combined ROI of the MG and batteries is just 4 years. If the delta between cheap and peak rates go up the ROI will be quicker.

The MG is on a 5 year lease, the batteries and inverter etc have a guarantee of 10 years, but at the 60% usage I am doing should last 20 years.

I do intend to add solar at some point, but no rush as the ROI would be 30+ years while I get cheap rate.

There some other benefits such as largely insulating me from power outages of less than a few days.
 
Sounds like you’ve got it well covered!
 
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