Tesla Opening Up Supercharger Network - A BAD Idea

[johnb80]

I have always thought it was a great idea to open up the Tesla network to everyone, why not? I'll tell you why........

I'm currently working on a contract for the next few months, it involves driving a survey equipped vehicle around 8 major cities in the UK. The vehicle is a Tesla Model Y and of course I have to charge it. The charging works absolutely fine with no complaints until yesterday in Romford. There are about 10 superchargers but this location they are open to all. 4 non tesla cars were charging which occupied all 10 charging bays. The supercharger leads are short (around 2 metres) and if your charging port isn't on the nearside rear or offside front the only way you can use the supercharger is by block the next bay thus preventing a Tesla charging. The vehicles concerned yesterday were not charging at 250 kW either so they tied the whole system up for a considerable time.
The only solution I can see is either longer leads or close the network down to Tesla only.

Operating the Tesla for the last few weeks has been an eyeopener and is a completely different experience to all other EV's I have driven / owned. The superchargers are normally plentiful and very, very quick, 20 minutes giving a useful boost to the range and at less than 50p/kWh is very competitive compared to the rest of the market. I'm pretty sure my next car will be a Tesla of one flavour or another.

 

[okohll]

Yes the next v4 chargers have longer leads for that reason I think, but it may take quite a while for them to filter through and become the majority

 

[Lovemyev]

Opening up the Tesla units to non Tesla models, was and always will be, very controversial.
Especially for the majority of Tesla owners as they believed that buying a Tesla gave them the exclusive rights to use them.
Two problems here as I see it.
1. Tesla cars and the Tesla super charging system is run as two completely different and separate entities and therefore stand alone.
More and more of these brilliant units are being installed almost on a weekly basis and this has created spare capacity at a lot of the sites.
Not wanting to miss out on an opportunity to creat more revenue for the company, they stated a gradual introduction to non Tesla owners.
The new V4 units are fitted with longer charging cables and a contactless payment method system, what does this indicate ?.
2) As the government has come under a lot of pressure about the slow ramp up to provide more fast chargers on the prime archery routes, then knowing that Tesla has plenty of units available, they have applied pressure to Tesla to open up some of their sites.
Instant fix for the government and maybe some concessions made to Tesla at the same time ????.
I honestly think that no Tesla owner ever believed that this was not likely to happen at some point really.

 

[johnb80]

Opening up the Tesla units to non Tesla models, was and always will be, very controversial.
Especially for the majority of Tesla owners as they believed that buying a Tesla gave them the exclusive rights to use them.

Which is the case, when i looked at Tesla it was a big thing promoted by the salesman.

Two problems here as I see it.
1. Tesla cars and the Tesla super charging system is run as two completely different and separate entities and therefore stand alone.

I'm not convinced that is the case, many of the earlier Model S cars had free supercharging, I dont see how that could work if the two companies were completely separate.

More and more of these brilliant units are being installed almost on a weekly basis and this has created spare capacity at a lot of the sites.
Not wanting to miss out on an opportunity to creat more revenue for the company, they stated a gradual introduction to non Tesla owners.

I can understand that but maybe they should restrict the opening up of the network to locations with longer leads and to cars that can charge in 30 minutes or less.

The new V4 units are fitted with longer charging cables and a contactless payment method system, what does this indicate ?.

I dont doubt it

2) As the government has come under a lot of pressure about the slow ramp up to provide more fast chargers on the prime archery routes, then knowing that Tesla has plenty of units available, they have applied pressure to Tesla to open up some of their sites.

Any evidence of this?

Instant fix for the government and maybe some concessions made to Tesla at the same time ????.
I honestly think that no Tesla owner ever believed that this was not likely to happen at some point really.

Agreed but I can understand the annoyance when one car blocks off two Superchargers and that same car is taking a long time to charge. I have just had a row with woman trying to position a Toyota in the Supercharger bay next to the one I was using, she parked diagonally into the bay blocking my exit, she 'explained' to me that it was the only way she could get the lead to reach. i explained in no uncertain terms that i'd be unhappy when my charging was done if i couldn't leave and furthermore the overstay fee incurred i would seek to recover from her with costs. She really couldnt see what the issue was, it was like talking to the wall.

 

[Roldorf]

I see lots of Teslas charging at non-Tesla chargers, so are you suggesting that Teslas should be banned from regular chargers? The only thing that is wrong with Tesla is that they made the charging cables to fit only their own cars (very shortsighted) and typically for Tesla it has taken them 4 iterations of their chargers to correct it..

 

[Lovemyev]

Any evidence of this?

Here is one article that mentions the talks that had taken place.

Tesla set to open up UK Supercharger network soon, says minister

All electric car owners will be able to use Tesla's prized Superchargers much sooner than expected, according to a government minister.

oakham.nub.news

Tesla Cars and the Tesla Super Charging network are under the same umbrella but report differently.

 

[Bricktop X PWR]

Having been on both sides of the argument, when I was a Tesla owner I never found a Supercharger I couldn't use due to them being at capacity.

If I had of found that I couldn't charge due to non Tesla owning EV drivers clogging up the ranks I reckon I would have been pretty angry about it.

Now I am a non Tesla owner, I used to feel a bit cheeky at using the network but have never been at a facility where there was a queue to get on, or have impeded a Tesla owner from getting a charge.

This is very much my usual experience.

 

[johnb80]

I see lots of Teslas charging at non-Tesla chargers, so are you suggesting that Teslas should be banned from regular chargers?

Not at all, I am suggesting the cars that can't fit in the charging bay should be banned.

The only thing that is wrong with Tesla is that they made the charging cables to fit only their own cars (very shortsighted) and typically for Tesla it has taken them 4 iterations of their chargers to correct it..

I'm not sure about the 'typically for Tesla', they got a lot right from the very start. New car manufacturer, new propulsion system, new fuel and fuelling, what a success.

 

[Archev]

I went to Stirling’s Castleview Park and Ride facility today, parked at a charger, plonked the RFID card on the reader, took the cable out of its under bonnet “nest” and coupled it up. The car immediately started feeding so I walked over and jumped on a bus to the city centre.
A wander, a haircut and a coffee later and I retraced the journey back to the car.
After umpteen attempts the charger would not give my cable back so I called CPS and the guy quickly ordered a release over the cloud.
I coiled up the cable and returned it to its hiding place and set about heading home.
I took a bit of a look at the card as I settled it back in my wallet.
I can confirm that the pensioner’s bus pass won’t communicate with car chargers

 

[johnb80]

Here is one article that mentions the talks that had taken place.

Tesla set to open up UK Supercharger network soon, says minister

All electric car owners will be able to use Tesla's prized Superchargers much sooner than expected, according to a government minister.

oakham.nub.news

Tesla Cars and the Tesla Super Charging network are under the same umbrella but report differently.

Thanks for that, I'm not convinced the government put pressure on Tesla. The article is 2 years old and they commented in the article the network would be opened in weeks rather than years, well, that hasn't happened, only about 1/3 have been opened.

 

[Lovemyev]

Thanks for that, I'm not convinced the government put pressure on Tesla. The article is 2 years old and they commented in the article the network would be opened in weeks rather than years, well, that hasnt happened, only about 1/3 have been opened.

Of course the article is over two years old!
But I am sure you total appreciate and understand John just how slowly the government wheels take to turn!
Remember that when Tesla intends to open more new sites all around the U.K. they will initially require the necessary consent etc of any local authorities and consent from the relevant DNO / grid etc, before installing their equipment.
If this application / request finds itself bogged down / delayed or even rejected, then the appeal process can causes long delays and therefore the lack of revenue being produced.
So, we arrive at the “Back Scratching” phase of the process between both parties.
Outcome - The government APPEARS to have responded (not) to the accusations in the press, that it has clearly fallen behind in its commitments to facilitate / provide the necessary charging infrastructure needed, that will meet its promised obligations, towards providing an alternative method of energy other than by using fossil fuels in motor vehicles in the very near future.
For Tesla - There applications / requests to install numerous super charger sites at many locations around the U.K. runs into no problems and therefore goes ahead smoothly.
Tesla has invested a lot of capital in installing all of these units and are looking for a return on that investment.
They are similar to commercial aircraft, in that they are not making any revenue when they are not being used.
They want them populated as much as possible.
Open to all EVs super charger units provide more profit to them, purely because these units can be less expensive than using some of the other third party providers.
Naturally given the choice, non Tesla EVs are going to opt for the cheaper rate open units.
Surely this is very likely to pull in a lot more none Tesla drivers, which proves my point.

 

[kiwi]

Opening up the Tesla Supercharger network to other makes? Best thing since sliced bread.

Charging lead and park layout to suit flap on left rear? Perfect for the MG4.

150 and 250 kW charge rate? Perfect for the MG4 140 kW charge rate.

Cost UK 50p / NZ 99c to charge? Yes, 20 to 40 % more than some competitors but (a) they’re fast, (b) they work, and (c) no silly RFID thingy required.

Benefit to Tesla? Everyone who uses the app is invited to look at Tesla models and, at least here in NZ, Tesla gets access to government EV charging infrastructure subsidies.

 

[johnb80]

Opening up the Tesla Supercharger network to other makes? Best thing since sliced bread.

I agree it's good except for the caveats mentioned.

Charging lead and park layout to suit flap on left rear? Perfect for the MG4.

Yes it is and other MG models with front charging points eg MG5. These cars dont cause the problem.

150 and 250 kW charge rate? Perfect for the MG4 140 kW charge rate.

Absoluitely but then a Toyota blocks 2 chargers and charges at 72 kW, not really perfect any more.

Cost UK 50p / NZ 99c to charge? Yes, 20 to 40 % more than some competitors but (a) they’re fast, (b) they work, and (c) no silly RFID thingy required.

Their pricing is excellent and will hopefully drive the competition prices down.

Benefit to Tesla? Everyone who uses the app is invited to look at Tesla models and, at least here in NZ, Tesla gets access to government EV charging infrastructure subsidies.

I cant comment on NZ, the UK has only about 1/3 of the Tesla network open, the sooner it gets closed or longer leads fitted, the better.

 

[DaevM]

Which is the case, when i looked at Tesla it was a big thing promoted by the salesman.



I'm not convinced that is the case, many of the earlier Model S cars had free supercharging, I dont see how that could work if the two companies were completely separate.


I can understand that but maybe they should restrict the opening up of the network to locations with longer leads and to cars that can charge in 30 minutes or less.


I dont doubt it


Any evidence of this?


Agreed but I can understand the annoyance when one car blocks off two Superchargers and that same car is taking a long time to charge. I have just had a row with woman trying to position a Toyota in the Supercharger bay next to the one I was using, she parked diagonally into the bay blocking my exit, she 'explained' to me that it was the only way she could get the lead to reach. i explained in no uncertain terms that i'd be unhappy when my charging was done if i couldn't leave and furthermore the overstay fee incurred i would seek to recover from her with costs. She really couldnt see what the issue was, it was like talking to the wall.

You've been Womansplained

I've had a ChadeMo Kia Soul for the last 5 years and looked on jealously as I heard Tesla were to open their charger network to non-tesla users. I've now bought an MG4 and yesterday carried out 2 x test charges on Tesla sites.
Presumably these were V4 chargers with the longer cables. Fitted both bay and car fine. Charged rapidly. An absolute pleasure to use.
Pleased to report I didn't get stoned by Tesla owners.

Thanks Elon. I am considering a Tesla as my next car - job done .

However there is no excuse for bad manners and unnecessarily hogging bays is inexcusable.

 

[Bricktop X PWR]

Pleased to report I didn't get stoned by Tesla owners.

You looked well outnumbered at Merry Hill M8!

Bloody Good Job you weren't blasphemous in anyway to our Lord Elon!

Stone Him! Stone Him!

 

[Gomev]

..
Presumably these were V4 chargers with the longer cables. Fitted both bay and car fine. Charged rapidly. An absolute pleasure to use.
..

If it had a contactless payment screen it was a V4.

 

[siteguru]

Cost UK 50p / NZ 99c to charge? Yes, 20 to 40 % more than some competitors but (a) they’re fast, (b) they work, and (c) no silly RFID thingy required.

In the UK the Tesla points are cheaper than most other competitors.

 

[Bricktop X PWR]

In the UK the Tesla points are cheaper than most other competitors.

Paid 37p Yesterday.

But that is members prices.

 

[tsedge]

Unmanned charging stations cannot have any kind of "ban" for practical reasons. You'd have to do it in software by recognising the car and knowing its type, but where do you get that data from? I suppose in theory you could have ANPR cameras to control entry but that would expensive re-engineering at every site.

Either Tesla need to lengthen the cables, upgrade to V4 or provide extension cables for non Tesla EVs.

 

[kiwi]

Tesla membership prices here in NZ range from 40c to 85c per kWh - approx 19p to 40p.