Disappointing winter range

[Tight Git]

You carnt do a balance till the battery is 100%

The NMC battery does balance at 80% (or higher) as shown in the pictures above from @Martinonline

 

[siteguru]

NMC battery will "balance" at any target SoC as far as I know - it doesn't have to be a minimum of 80%

LFP will only balance at 100% because there's no facility to set a target SoC.

 

[Kithmo]

I was shocked last Winter by how much range it loses in the cold weather, but now I'm only paying 9p/kWh it's less of a worry. This last few weeks I've been charging for free with my EDF Sunday saver tariff where if you cut down your use at peak hours, 4pm-7pm, then they give you free electricity on Sundays.

 

[Slipstream]

The NMC battery does balance at 80% (or higher) as shown in the pictures above from @Martinonline

Didn't realise it's NMC Battery.

 

[Tig170]

Sub zero temps - you need to be realistic on a non heat pump EV. Accept 100 miles on the SE & 150 miles on the LR.

 

[Bam Bam]

Sub zero temps - you need to realistic on a non heat pump EV. Accept 100 miles on the SE & 150 miles on the LR.

Wow that's a lot worse than the 130 miles that EV Database predicts for the SE at 70mph in minus 10 degrees. That is 2.6mi/kWh.

100 mile range would mean 2mi/kWh.

And here was I thinking I could make it from South Oxfordshire to Nottingham in one charge tomorrow if we took my car.

 

[Tig170]

... this is the worst case scenario at 2miles/kWh. Today for example on a normal 50 mile trip in zero temp conditions was 2mi/kWh. My LFP battery is down to 93% SOH = fine given the 30k miles. In 2 more years the car will have paid for itself =

 

[tsedge]

I drive an MG4 LR and the range I am getting at the moment is disappointing. I know that in colder weather the range drops off but right now it seems excessive. The quoted range for this model is 281 and in the summer months it goes above 300. At the moment it's dropped to 163 on 100% battery. On any longish trips the range is limiting.
Anyone else got comments on this subject?


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What modes do you drive in? How fast do you drive?

With my LR Trophy, in Sport/Adaptive with an enthusiastic right foot and 70+ on motorway, I get 160-170 miles in winter, 190-200 miles in summer. This is actual and predicted range, which I find generally accurate.

But on ECO/High mode, plus ECO AC plus powersave mode and driving gently and at 60-65 on motorway, I get 200-210 miles in winter and 240-250 miles in summer.

It is dominated by the modes, how you drive and the terrain, temperature and winds.

Consequently I drive almost everywhere in Sport/Adaptive and enthusiastically, as I only need the range on occasional long journeys.

Because it would add about £1000 to the cost and would only be useful a small part of the year.

MG UK will have decided where they want to save money so decided to not spec one for the UK

Agreed, heat pumps are marginal cost/benefit in the UK, may well make sense in other countries.

NMC battery will "balance" at any target SoC as far as I know - it doesn't have to be a minimum of 80%

LFP will only balance at 100% because there's no facility to set a target SoC.

Yes, although calibration of the battery also matters for accurate range prediction on the NMC and that is best done with 100% balance charge (and occasional discharge to 10%).

 

[siteguru]

Re. your last point - I agree. The point I was making was that the LR (NMC) cars can balance (I believe, and to an extent) at pretty much any SoC ... it's not restricted to a minimum of 80% as was implied by @Tight Git.

 

[Anon70]

I was shocked last Winter by how much range it loses in the cold weather,

Everyone should buy their EV in the Winter. Mine was delivered 5/12/23 which means my ownership experience started with a worst case scenario and I saw range getting better, to return to its original levels the following Winter.

I guess perspective can make a difference to the user experience

 

[siteguru]

Likewise ... I got mine at the end of November 2022 so I'm now in my 3rd winter with the car.

 

[Kithmo]

Everyone should buy their EV in the Winter. Mine was delivered 5/12/23 which means my ownership experience started with a worst case scenario and I saw range getting better, to return to its original levels the following Winter.

I guess perspective can make a difference to the user experience

I had been through 3 winters with my ZS EV prior to getting the 4.
The ZS only suffered a 25% drop in Winter, the 4 drops 35% in Winter, same trips, that's why I was so shocked.

 

[Alb]

I've done similar calculations on my MG5.
Average Winter consumption is approximately 20% higher than average Summer consumption.

 

[NLMGSAN]

To be honoust, the range of my ER is far from impressive. Summer or winter. But it really makes a huge difference if you drive short distances every day in winter, or if you drive longer ones.
In the current weather, around 0°C and occasional rain or snow, the first 10 km start with maximum consumption (29.8 kWh/100 km) in my ER. It takes about 5 kms to get it down into a low 20 and only after 10 km it drops to something like 17-18 per 100 with speeds between 40-60 km/h. Then I drive up the motorway and it stays there (or even drops a bit). This is something like 3.5 miles per kWh.
Of course in the beginning you are using energy to heat up your car. That doesn't help getting decent numbers in. And I clearly see a trend of more than than average power consumption when accelerating when the battery is still cold.

I do not know the trip characteristics of the OP. But if it is short distances mainly, I'm not suprised at all.

 

[tsedge]

All of our helpful explanations aside, I do think it is reasonable for people to be surprised.

Winter range isn't well advertised and I bet many salespeople avoid mentioning it (if they know about it) in case it puts people off.

I'd like to see:

• Revised and more realistic testing regime - most people should be able to get the official figures with normal driving.
• Two official figures quoted: summer and winter range.

 

[JonnyG]

I see the WLTP mpg tests are changing for PHEV hybrid cars, to make the current ridiculously high mpg figures more realistic.

As you say it would be good to see a Winter test for EVs (or say a realistic WLTP test range figure for both 20c and -10c say). It would make things more transparent for the buying public IMHO.

 

[JIS]

I drive an MG4 LR and the range I am getting at the moment is disappointing. I know that in colder weather the range drops off but right now it seems excessive. The quoted range for this model is 281 and in the summer months it goes above 300. At the moment it's dropped to 163 on 100% battery. On any longish trips the range is limiting.
Anyone else got comments on this subject?


View attachment 33817

Funnily enough, it was 0°C today when we set off for the shops. What was significant was not the stated possible range but the fact that normally, I see a consumption of 15-16 kWh / 100km whereas this morning it immediately displayed a reading of 29 kWh / 100km. In other words, the battery is consuming double the power it did last month, when it was around 15°C. So, yes, it means that my range is effectives halved from 420 km (64 kWh battery) to around 250 km. It just means more frequent charging stops I guess.

 

[Everest]

Sub zero temps - you need to be realistic on a non heat pump EV. Accept 100 miles on the SE & 150 miles on the LR.

Are those distances based on several real-life journeys or hear-say? Genuine question as I'm looking to buy an MG4 soon.

 

[Tight Git]

Are those distances based on several real-life journeys or hear-say? Genuine question as I'm looking to buy an MG4 soon.

I regularly do a 240 mile return journey (480 mile total) over two days in my SE SR and can do each leg with one charge each way and a charge at the mid way point. It will do 150 miles from full even when very cold as long as you stick to about 60mph.

When I'm not travelling long distance I don't really care what the range is as it gets plugged in when needed so doesn't matter if it's every 3 days or whatever. It's so cheap to run on Intelligent Octopus Go at 7p/kWh.

Now on 42,000 miles with no issues and will never go back to ICE.

 

[NLMGSAN]

Are those distances based on several real-life journeys or hear-say? Genuine question as I'm looking to buy an MG4 soon.

My numbers are real.