Does the MG4 come with a heat pump?

[siteguru]

Ditto. I didn't need all the bells and whistles on the Trophy (never had them before so won't miss them), and I couldn't justify a £2.5k price hike for the few occasions when I'd need to go longer distances ... £2.5k is a hell of a lot of rapid charges!

 

[BugEyed]

Not all European models have the heat pump, for example only the German Luxury does.

nope according to my dealer all european luxury models have it, my spanish ordered one as well.

What I meant was that in Germany only the Luxury has the Wärmepumpe. It is on the Luxury throughout Europe according to the MG EU website, but of course the UK isn't part of Europe ....

The above is from the MG europe website.

 

[memo]

What I meant was that in Germany only the Luxury has the Wärmepumpe. It is on the Luxury throughout Europe according to the MG EU website, but of course the UK isn't part of Europe ....

View attachment 13161


The above is from the MG europe website.

Hehe yeah, I know, I live in Spain and my luxury is ordered here not in UK.

 

[FunkyJunky]

I have been led to understand that another main reason for the Heat Pump is to be able to "condition" the battery in preparation for DC Fast Charging, and that without it it cant change at the maximum rate that one with can?

 

[Cocijo]

I have been led to understand that another main reason for the Heat Pump is to be able to "condition" the battery in preparation for DC Fast Charging, and that without it it cant change at the maximum rate that one with can?

Can you please share the source of your understanding?

 

[FunkyJunky]

Can you please share the source of your understanding?

I think it was in here

 

[Cocijo]

Ok. It’s a good point. My answer is - I don’t know!
My thoughts are;
My understanding is that battery pre-conditioning is not dependent on a heat pump (obviously because many cars have pre-conditioning but no heat pump - MG4 in the UK for example).
Wether a heat pump (where fitted) contributes towards heating the battery prior to DC charging and that this is done more efficiently, I’m unsure.
I would guess that a heat pump might overall improve how efficiently the pack was heated if required. Battery heating has a specific system that uses a flow pump and heats liquid that flows around the cells (there are some variations).
Cars with battery pre-conditioning but no heat pump will DC charge just as fast providing that the heating does it’s job and gets the pack to temperature. Wether a car with a heat pump pre-conditions the pack quicker or to a higher temperature in very cold weather I don‘t know.
In very cold weather a car with heat pump might get the pack to temperature more efficiently and faster and therefore aid faster charging - perhaps!
However, I would not say that battery pre-conditioning is a main reason for a heat pump.

 

[tsedge]

Ok. It’s a good point. My answer is - I don’t know!
My thoughts are;
My understanding is that battery pre-conditioning is not dependent on a heat pump (obviously because many cars have pre-conditioning but no heat pump - MG4 in the UK for example).
Wether a heat pump (where fitted) contributes towards heating the battery prior to DC charging and that this is done more efficiently, I’m unsure.
I would guess that a heat pump might overall improve how efficiently the pack was heated if required. Battery heating has a specific system that uses a flow pump and heats liquid that flows around the cells (there are some variations).
Cars with battery pre-conditioning but no heat pump will DC charge just as fast providing that the heating does it’s job and gets the pack to temperature. Wether a car with a heat pump pre-conditions the pack quicker or to a higher temperature in very cold weather I don‘t know.
In very cold weather a car with heat pump might get the pack to temperature more efficiently and faster and therefore aid faster charging - perhaps!
However, I would not say that battery pre-conditioning is a main reason for a heat pump.

Yes, battery conditioning doesn't require a heat pump, heat pumps make heating (and cooling) more efficient at the expense of being slower to deliver the temperature change, which is why in cold weather even on cars with a heat pump, typically a heater is used initially and the heat pump switches in later, so your car heats up rapidly.

There is no such thing as "needing a heat pump", just a trade off between the price of fitting one and the benefit of any extended range. Typically heat pumps use half the energy of a PTC heater.

 

[Cocijo]

Yes, battery conditioning doesn't require a heat pump, heat pumps make heating (and cooling) more efficient at the expense of being slower to deliver the temperature change, which is why in cold weather even on cars with a heat pump, typically a heater is used initially and the heat pump switches in later, so your car heats up rapidly.

There is no such thing as "needing a heat pump", just a trade off between the price of fitting one and the benefit of any extended range. Typically heat pumps use half the energy of a PTC heater.

I think that the question was if a heat pump contributed towards or improved battery pre-conditioning.

 

[Deleted member 10041]

I've been chatting regularly now in the Renault Mégane forum to a Mégane owner from Finland, his car obviously has a heat pump and he obviously experiences harsher winters than us. His take on the heat pump is that it only really comes into its own on longer journeys. Short stop and go journeys makes no difference at all. He did say the other benefit is that if you do a longer journey and park up it continues to run and heat the cabin for a while meaning if you are not away long and then come back to the car it's still pretty warm and doesn't take that much to heat it back up again.
He is keeping data from over the winter to do a comparison bit at the moment for most of his driving the difference is negligible.

 

[tsedge]

I think that the question was if a heat pump contributed towards or improved battery pre-conditioning.

It can reduce the energy needed to do it, that's about it. It won't pre-condition faster.

I've been chatting regularly now in the Renault Mégane forum to a Mégane owner from Finland, his car obviously has a heat pump and he obviously experiences harsher winters than us. His take on the heat pump is that it only really comes into its own on longer journeys. Short stop and go journeys makes no difference at all. He did say the other benefit is that if you do a longer journey and park up it continues to run and heat the cabin for a while meaning if you are not away long and then come back to the car it's still pretty warm and doesn't take that much to heat it back up again.
He is keeping data from over the winter to do a comparison bit at the moment for most of his driving the difference is negligible.

Yes, this is probably because the heat pump isn't being used during the short journeys.

 

[JuziWomble]

I had a leaf it had a heat pump .. but low range / my 4 trophy has way way more range and no heat pump / am I bothered … nope !
Simples

 

[Cocijo]

It can reduce the energy needed to do it, that's about it. It won't pre-condition faster.

How does it reduce the energy needed to pre-condition?

 

[siteguru]

How does it reduce the energy needed to pre-condition?

It reduces the energy drain from the battery, as the heat pump helps to heat the battery "cooling" fluid - so overall it improves efficiency. (With caveats re. type and length of journeys).

 

[Cocijo]

It reduces the energy drain from the battery, as the heat pump helps to heat the battery "cooling" fluid - so overall it improves efficiency. (With caveats re. type and length of journeys).

I don’t know the answer, as it’s a new area for me. So the heat pump contributes directly to pre-conditioning the battery?

 

[tsedge]

How does it reduce the energy needed to pre-condition?

Because it is a more efficient form of heater.

I don’t know the answer, as it’s a new area for me. So the heat pump contributes directly to pre-conditioning the battery?

I should say most likely, assuming the MG4 uses it for battery pre-conditioning. It would make sense if it did but I don't know for sure.

 

[DangerousDoug]

Regarding heat pumps in the UK, I've been driving a Kia e-Niro for 2 1/2 years now, and had another one before this one (my wife drives the MG4). My first e-Niro didn't have a heat pump, and the current one does. Otherwise they were basically the same (4 level vs 4+ level trim). I noticed no difference at all in efficiency and range with heating at max, between the two cars. I asked my (very friendly and knowledgeable) dealer about this and he admitted "in the UK it makes almost no difference - just heats up the cabin a bit quicker". So there you have it - direct comparison of with/without in otherwise identical cars. It may be a nice to have, but I definately wouldn't make it a factor in choosing a car!
Addendum to above, my wife's MG4 heats up quicker than my e-Niro, and she doesn't have a heat pump and I do.

 

[siteguru]

The PTC heater in the MG4 is pretty good.

 

[stevegus]

That's what the UK based headquarters who have finalized the specs will tell you.

If you live anywhere from the midlands up, a heat pump make complete sense.

I cant begin to tell you how little this would affect my decision to buy or not.

Who cares? Personally i dont need to eek every mile ( i bought lr) and ev is eco enough already

 

[Deleted member 10041]

Stageshoot did a comparison between his Kona 64kw with heat pump ( efficient car at best of times) and his EV6.
150 miles 3 HR journey on motorway, 0-3°c Kona got 7 miles more range