Sleeping in MG4 [merged thread]

[mg4mc]

Hmm, post #15?

 

[Rolfe]

Yes of course I will do so.
It's quite simple.
After first identification of the fuses I would recommend to mark them with nail polish just to find them more quickly if needed.

Never mind the photos, Ramontiker, that was childishly simple.

The reason for the delay was that I have just installed a new wireless router, and when I tried to print the diagram and key from your link I discovered that my computer and my printer were no longer on speaking terms, despite both being connected to the new router. Took me ages working through various troubleshooting routines, and in the end I just went out to the car and did it, using the diagram on my phone screen.

It's no more hassle than putting the blindfolds on, by the time you've dug them out of the bag and so on. Brilliant. Last piece of the puzzle in place.

Hmm, post #15?

Yes, I see that now, and I saw it at the time, but you were just a wee bit synoptic for me. I didn't even know about the fuse box under the bonnet, all I knew about was the one where you have to take an interior panel off to access it. I thought that was what you meant, and didn't fancy the idea. The "Remove the driver's side knee trim panel" part alarmed me because I had heard people say it was a tricky job. If you look back at the thread the first reply to you was talking about fitting a switch, and then someone remarked that we needed to find someone who knew how to tinker with the fuses, and no further enlightenment appeared.

Ramontiker, bless his little cotton socks, explained how easy it was, linked to a useful resource, and even mentioned the tweezers which I would definitely not have noticed if he hadn't said that.

So, 10/10 for good thinking and about 1/10 for clear communication that could be understood by the relatively non-techie.

PS: I finally managed to make the printer show itself to the computer, but I have very little idea how!

 

[Jamesrr]

...

PS: I finally managed to make the printer show itself to the computer, but I have very little idea how!

Did you turn it off and back on again

 

[Rolfe]

Several times, but that wasn't the thing that did it. (And I rebooted the router several times and the computer once.) I think deleting all the printer software and re-installing it was what fixed it in the end.

Re-reading the beginning of this thread, @mg4mc mentioned the fuses twice, and the second time I said no, putting the magnetic blinds over the lights was easier. Someone else also said the same thing. But nobody ever explained the exact procedure or pointed out how simple it is. People talked about installing switches and things like that. So Ramontiker gets the gold medal for actually explaining the procedure.

I think if it's just aurora-watching the magnetic blinds are still the easiest thing, but if you're sleeping in the car all night the fuse trick is obviously the one to go for.

 

[decrep]

just remember to stick them back in before you drive off

 

[Archev]

Several times, but that wasn't the thing that did it. (And I rebooted the router several times and the computer once.) I think deleting all the printer software and re-installing it was what fixed it in the end.

Re-reading the beginning of this thread, @mg4mc mentioned the fuses twice, and the second time I said no, putting the magnetic blinds over the lights was easier. Someone else also said the same thing. But nobody ever explained the exact procedure or pointed out how simple it is. People talked about installing switches and things like that. So Ramontiker gets the gold medal for actually explaining the procedure.

I think if it's just aurora-watching the magnetic blinds are still the easiest thing, but if you're sleeping in the car all night the fuse trick is obviously the one to go for.

Fiddly wee devils I find . I’d carry a couple of spares with me because I’d be sure to drop one and it would bounce into the engineless cavern, twice on the suspension and sink slowly ‘neath the ripples on the muddy puddle I was parked over.
Or is it just me ?

 

[T1 Terry]

I couldn't find the link in post 16, but would this be similar https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1455438...YM5XON5KTy_W5BY-hr-1FyQiRyi26goYaAsPcEALw_wcB

I was think, if the system only needed to be on and not in ready mode for the heater to work, is it possible to locate a circuit that is only powered after the ready mode is achieved.

My thinking was, the fuse could be replaced by one of these plugs and wired across a relay that turned on when ready mode was achieved, but otherwise it would be off ...... alternatively, a small rocker switch wired under the dash somewhere that could be switched to turn the lights off when camping.

I'll have a look through the wiring diagram (when I find the time) and see if there is a way turn the relay into a ratcheting relay, so a press of an instantaneous break circuit switch (N/C) would uncouple the ratcheted relay but it would reset when the system was next turned on ......

The advantage of the plug into the fuse socket is it can be easily removed and put back to standard, no need to cut into any wiring

T1 Terry

 

[T1 Terry]

Fiddly wee devils I find . I’d carry a couple of spares with me because I’d be sure to drop one and it would bounce into the engineless cavern, twice on the suspension and sink slowly ‘neath the ripples on the muddy puddle I was parked over.
Or is it just me ?

Nah, much like the clothes dryer that eats one sock, that area you can't see into anywhere in the under bonnet area is a link to a parallel universe ....... Your frustration is only having to find a replacement, the poor bugga on the other side has to find where this mystery fuse/nut/bolt came from ..... but he has quite a collection of 10mm spanners and sockets and socks he never remembers owning .....
So, next time, rather than cursing up a storm, think of the other poor bugger and maybe drop him a note that might help him with his confusion ...... and buy multiple pairs of the same socks, at least that way he gets a bonus pair of socks for his trouble and eventually you will end up with a matching single sock (though a slightly different level of faded) that you can reunite and put in your socks drawer with warm fuzzy feeling of at least achieving something that day

I know, I should be on stage, the last one headed out of town preferably

T1 Terry

 

[Ramontiker]

Just to make sure
It was and is not my intention to encourage anyone unfamiliar with the car's electrical system to modify it. I consider it potentially dangerous, and in the worst case, improper wiring can cause wire fires.
Pulling the fuse is not risky, as both fuses have the same rating, so confusion is impossible.
Pulling the fuses multiple times will also not overload the fuse contacts.
The fuses are type Micro 2 yellow with rated 20A (for spare parts). A weaker point as the fuse rating in improperly installed additional wiring, connectors, switches, or relays poses a fire hazard that must be avoided at all costs.
Just my opinion

Furthermore, an interruption caused by the failure of an additional wiring connection can lead to the sudden failure of one or both headlights, possibly while driving. Nobody wants to experience that....

 

[Ramontiker]

I couldn't find the link in post 16, but would this be similar https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/145543816432?chn=ps&_ul=AU&_trkparms=ispr=1&amdata=enc:1O_UeAJMKSS2KVCEZjyTbVQ26&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=705-139619-5960-0&mkcid=2&mkscid=101&itemid=145543816432&targetid=2370046502538&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=1000286&poi=&campaignid=21766134162&mkgroupid=175112620264&rlsatarget=pla-2370046502538&abcId=10047381&merchantid=745732456&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=21766134162&gclid=Cj0KCQjwgvnCBhCqARIsADBLZoJ5VlSffVJNjigohSgIGGeYM5XON5KTy_W5BY-hr-1FyQiRyi26goYaAsPcEALw_wcB

I was think, if the system only needed to be on and not in ready mode for the heater to work, is it possible to locate a circuit that is only powered after the ready mode is achieved.

My thinking was, the fuse could be replaced by one of these plugs and wired across a relay that turned on when ready mode was achieved, but otherwise it would be off ...... alternatively, a small rocker switch wired under the dash somewhere that could be switched to turn the lights off when camping.

I'll have a look through the wiring diagram (when I find the time) and see if there is a way turn the relay into a ratcheting relay, so a press of an instantaneous break circuit switch (N/C) would uncouple the ratcheted relay but it would reset when the system was next turned on ......

The advantage of the plug into the fuse socket is it can be easily removed and put back to standard, no need to cut into any wiring

T1 Terry

The linked extention cords are rated 15 Amps only and therefore dangerous because the Fuse is rated 20 Amps. So the extention cord becomes the weak spot in the circuit and not the fuse.

 

[Rolfe]

Just to make sure
It was and is not my intention to encourage anyone unfamiliar with the car's electrical system to modify it. I consider it potentially dangerous, and in the worst case, improper wiring can cause wire fires.
Pulling the fuse is not risky, as both fuses have the same rating, so confusion is impossible.
Pulling the fuses multiple times will also not overload the fuse contacts.
The fuses are type Micro 2 yellow with rated 20A (for spare parts). A weaker point as the fuse rating in improperly installed additional wiring, connectors, switches, or relays poses a fire hazard that must be avoided at all costs.
Just my opinion

I couldn't agree more. It was the immediate diversion into talk of switches and bypass circuits and so on that deterred me from pursuing this solution earlier. Pulling the fuses is childishly simple and takes just a couple of minutes. There's little danger of losing them as they can just be laid inside the fuse box.

Given the amount of palaver involved in setting up camp, it's a nothing-burger. Sure, remember to replace them before you drive off, but even if you forget, DRLs aren't a legal requirement and you'd be OK on a sunny day. You'd remember at some point.

@mg4mc, you might have expanded on your point and explained how easy it was, when it became obvious that nobody was getting it!

 

[T1 Terry]

The linked extention cords are rated 15 Amps only and therefore dangerous because the Fuse is rated 20 Amps. So the extention cord becomes the weak spot in the circuit and not the fuse.

Hmmm...... 20 amps x even 12V, but more likely 14V, 2400w per headlight ..... seriously, check the cable size used to wire in the headlight globes .... does that look like wire that can handle more than 20 amps ..... remember, the fuse must open circuit before the insulation on the wire becomes hot enough to deform, not the wire getting hot enough to catch the insulation on fire ....... so, maybe those 20 amp fuses power a lot more than the headlights each side ......

T1 Terry
Fixed, a 15 amp fuse would be overkill I think, they are LED headlights after all, a 240W LED would certainly be bright ...... not sure how you would keep it cool though

 

[mg4mc]

I think you have an extra zero in there! 240W.

I think they have used 1.5mm² thin-walled cable which is nominally rated at 21 A.

And yes, the fuses only supply the headlamp units. 20A does seem like over kill, though it would be interesting to see what current the multi-LED lamps on the Trophy draw.

@Rolfe, I'm just the ideas man, if you need more detail, you can but ask.

 

[Rolfe]

Funnily enough, early in the thread when we were talking about this, someone said the fuses were different ratings, one 20A and one 25A. But mine are both 20A and both are said to be 20A in the page @Ramontiker linked to. Maybe someone ran out of 20A fuses one day.

Your idea was stellar, but if everyone has assumed it's a complicated operation they're not even going to ask.

 

[Rolfe]

@Rolfe, I'm just the ideas man, if you need more detail, you can but ask.

See, here's an example of the issue. As late as January the discussion about turning off the DRLs was still dominated by this sort of proposition. I mean, just NO. Not in a million years.

I've gotten rather interested in this thread and the concept in general. I'm now researching my own setup and plans.

I did come across this today which shows it IS possible (albeit rather brute force) to disable the DRLs.

I hadn't seen mention of it so apologies if it's already posted somewhere.

Another resource I found which I haven't seen mentioned is an app Park4Night which has user submitted and maintained parking spots (generally for camper vans but the principle is the same, we just don't need to be bothered if you can ONLY fit a 6m van in )

Airbed on the way to test out the mechanics of it in the driveway before I venture further from home and realise what I've forgotten

For goodness sake, why? Why go to all that trouble and faff, cutting wires and installing new switches on the steering column, if it's as simple as opening that black box at the top right and pulling a couple of fuses out with the supplied pincers? I didn't even know that there were fuses in that black box until Ramontiker pointed it out. I thought they were behind the panel in front of the driver's right knee.

A couple of bare remarks about "why not just pull the two fuses" was as nothing against this sort of suggestion, which by the very fact that someone had gone to all that trouble to do that, tacitly implied that there wasn't a simpler solution staring the guy right in the face all the time.

 

[Ramontiker]

As an electronics technician, I find the solution of pulling the fuses to be simple and safe. It's the ideal solution for a task that doesn't need to be performed very often. However, if you want to deactivate the daytime running lights frequently, for example, because you often want to use the air conditioning in the dark while the vehicle is stationary, another solution might be more appropriate. Wiring into the interior with two or one combined switch is probably more convenient and also allows the headlights to be activated in an emergency if you're sleeping in the vehicle. As an electronics technician, I tend to look for smart solutions, and because interfering with the vehicle's control system isn't easily possible, I considered remote relays that can be activated wirelessly from outside and from within the vehicle. However, all the effort involved in designing and creating a safe and reliable system ultimately seemed too academic and too expensive for me. My intention, after finding simple solutions for comfortable and unobtrusive overnight stays in the vehicle with the help of many helpful forum posts, was to explicitly point out the previously mentioned "keep it simple" solution for deactivating the daytime running lights. I'm happy if my posts help other users, even those with little electrical experience, and I also appreciate the contributions of users looking for more sophisticated solutions.
I would like to read more travel reports and reports on overnight stays in electric vehicles in general. I personally had a lot of experience car camping in Southern Europe with my Fiat Panda in the early 1980s, and I'm absolutely thrilled with the capabilities of the MG. Even though there's still room for improvement compared to our over three-year-old Tesla M3 AWD, the MG is currently my favorite for various other reasons.

 

[Rolfe]

I appreciate that some people might have a need for something more sophisticated than pulling the fuses, but it was quite astonishing to me, reading back through the thread, how many people were going round and round the houses suggesting quite complicated solutions needing a lot of technical expertise without even acknowledging (or realising) that there was a very simple non-techie solution right there. While @mg4mc certainly did realise, nobody picked up on what he was saying and the conversation invariably drifted back to switches and relays and stuff I personally wouldn't touch with a barge pole.

I still think it's a bug. What needs to happen is that selecting the "lights off" position on the stalk should be impossible to do while the car is in motion (or indeed, in Ready), but that when it is selected, in Park, all the damn lights go out.

But hey, that's what we MG4 owners do. We bitch like hell about the software bugs, then find a work-round. Then say, told you so, thanks for fixing it two years later, give me that software update please. Who knows if they'll ever get to this one!

So for myself, I have two solutions for the DRLs now. If it's not critical that the car stays completely dark and/or it's only for a short time, the blackout curtains will probably do. If it's important that the car is dark, and/or it's for an overnight stay, pull the fuses. Nothing to complain about for camping now. I have my bed, inflated and deflated by the VtL, I have my heating/aircon, and I have the ability to kill those lights. And I have hot water again via the VtL for washing and making tea. (And pot noodles and cup-a-soup and expensive dehydratd meals.) What more could one ask for?

 

[MG Clive]

First of all, I don't know if this fuse fits our car, but a fuse with a switch on it would be ideal, no need to remove it, just switch it on and off.

Here in Ebay.

 

[mg4mc]

Never seen a switched car fuse before! A neat solution.

If I were going to introduce a relay or switch in the cabin, I'd switch the DRL control line (just one wire out of the Body Control Module that controls both lights) rather than the main power feed.

The lamps work by having a fused power input, then separate control lines to switch on/off the main beam, dip, DRL, and adjustment motors. These carry no current to speak of.

Failing a software fix, then a relay on the DRL that was fed from a source that was only live when the car was in Ready mode would be the best solution. The DRLs would be off if you were just sat in the car, but always come on when driving. No forgetting to put fuses back!

 

[Rolfe]

First of all, I don't know if this fuse fits our car, but a fuse with a switch on it would be ideal, no need to remove it, just switch it on and off.
View attachment 37773
Here in Ebay.

That's tempting. Anyone going to buy a couple and see if they work?