What's the effect on battery life of regularly charging to 100%

[siteguru]

• Energy saving on in ECO mode - Please explain, thanks.
  It's an option in one of the menus under the Car icon - it helps to minimise energy usage in the ECO drive mode
• ECO set on AC - I know about the Eco drive mode, but not ECO on on the AC - please explain, thanks?
  It's an option in the AC page - it sets the AC to lower performance (less drain on the battery) when ECO drive mode is set
• Intelligent battery heating set to OFF - Never heard of this, please explain, thanks?
  It's an option under the Energy Consumption tab in the Battery tile from the Home screen - you don't want this on else it'll generally use more battery than what it tries to save

 

[profdraper]

This is getting ridiculous. There's a genuine problem of SR owners not understanding that their battery chemistry is different and that they shouldn't be following the ubiquitous instructions about charging that are all over the place but apply only to the NMC batteries. The title of this thread said nothing about it applying only to the LR batteries.

When you find that owners of NMC batteries are being confused because everyone is talking about LFP batteries as if they were the only sort that existed, you might have a point.

We already have Trophy owners swarming all over the SE threads telling us that their cars don't behave like this. We don't need any more.

Exactly right ... plus, I feel somewhat left out, having owned two ZS EVs over the last five years or so; a gen 1 with NMC battery & now a gen 2 SR with LFP. I have never had any problems with either car, the service centre has always been brilliant as is the warranty & roadside assist, and surley cannot believe or reconclie the constant winging & bitching that goes on in internet forums like this.

Yeah, SAIC is a Chinese government-owned comapany that builds to a useful pricepoint (somehow the Europeans seem to think this is 'unfair practice'). If you want more, surely go buy a Volvo, Audi or BMW etc. Nearly of of this bitching seems to revolve around 'cheap' cars - speaking of which, BYD are nailing it with LFP blade batteries right accross all of the range. The LF-SR /NMC-LR duality is common for many EVs for the moment (Tesla, MG, EX30 etc) whereas other EU brands are stuck with a single NMC on everything. Again, BYD will be changing that up shortly with their Sodium hybrid chemistry.

The bottom line would seem to be that rather than venting about some problem into the inetrnet aether, surely a combination of internet search or simply talking with the servise centre would take care of that. I can only imagine that there must be literally tens of thousands of MG EV owners accross the world who have no need to particiate in this kind of 'death by a thousand tuts', not to mention the mild underlying racism that seem to go with this (then again, the UK proved to be the nitwits that got sucked in by internet disinformation & did Brexit, no?).

 

[Steve Nug]

Exactly right ... plus, I feel somewhat left out, having owned two ZS EVs over the last five years or so; a gen 1 with NMC battery & now a gen 2 SR with LFP. I have never had any problems with either car, the service centre has always been brilliant as is the warranty & roadside assist, and surley cannot believe or reconclie the constant winging & bitching that goes on in internet forums like this.

Yeah, SAIC is a Chinese government-owned comapany that builds to a useful pricepoint (somehow the Europeans seem to think this is 'unfair practice'). If you want more, surely go buy a Volvo, Audi or BMW etc. Nearly of of this bitching seems to revolve around 'cheap' cars - speaking of which, BYD are nailing it with LFP blade batteries right accross all of the range. The LF-SR /NMC-LR duality is common for many EVs for the moment (Tesla, MG, EX30 etc) whereas other EU brands are stuck with a single NMC on everything. Again, BYD will be changing that up shortly with their Sodium hybrid chemistry.

The bottom line would seem to be that rather than venting about some problem into the inetrnet aether, surely a combination of internet search or simply talking with the servise centre would take care of that. I can only imagine that there must be literally tens of thousands of MG EV owners accross the world who have no need to particiate in this kind of 'death by a thousand tuts', not to mention the mild underlying racism that seem to go with this (then again, the UK proved to be the nitwits that got sucked in by internet disinformation & did Brexit, no?).

As a Brit I agree Nitwits indeed. I'll let you guess which way I voted

 

[Tangoed Man]

Charging to 100% is fine whenever you need it, it is recommended at least once a month to balance the battery.

The thing that ages a battery is time spent at 100% (or close to it), that's what you want to minimise - so don't leave it with a high state of charge. Rapid charging also has a wearing effect.

However, batteries last so well that it won't really affect you unless you plan to keep the car for 10 years and go well around the clock. All the models should be good for 200,000 miles with a decent battery life left.

Also make sure she has:

• ECO mode on
• Energy saving on in ECO mode
• ECO set on AC
• AC Temperature not too high and low fan speed
• Intelligent battery heating set to OFF

145 miles should be no trouble at all for a LR, minimum I get even driving hard in sport mode is around 180 miles.

50mph should give you around 4m/kWh or more, suggesting that something is not set right.

Finally, there's nothing wrong with getting home with 12%.

Hi. I wasn't aware that rapid charging was necessarily detrimental to the battery. How so, provided the car has decent battery cooling capability?

 

[fnegroni]

Hi. I wasn't aware that rapid charging was necessarily detrimental to the battery. How so, provided the car has decent battery cooling capability?

I asked ChatGPT and here is the answer:

Fast charging uses a high-voltage current to charge the battery. Lithium ions are pulled from the cathode with greater force and are moved to the anode when charged. This causes cracks in the cathode and also generates dendrites on the electrodes.
High-speed charging generates heat, and excessive heat is one of the main factors that can degrade a battery over time. This is why some manufacturers recommend using DC fast charging sparingly, especially if the battery is near its maximum state of charge.

 

[Tangoed Man]

Ah, ok. From deep research I have seen it is not so much the speed of charging that damages a battery, but the depth of discharge.

[ Edit moderator: "depth of charge" → "depth of discharge" ]

 

[fnegroni]

Ah, ok. From deep research I have seen it is not so much the speed of charging that damages a battery, but the depth of charge.

Depth of Discharge combined with State of Charge yes.
But the slower the charge the better. At least with the current (oops!) technology.
In the future this might become a non-problem.

I mean it is a non-problem already in the sense the effect is too small for any practical automotive application for personal transportation.
Heavy good vehicles, aeroplanes, trains, boats etc do care about these things.

 

[Tangoed Man]

I am not sure it has ever been a problem. Fast charging to, say, 80% causes negligible impact provided the temperature can be controlled. I need to check about ultrafast chargers.

 

[Corindikev]

Most people don't even worry about the charge rate or how it affects the longevity of the battery. In Australia MG provides a 7 year unlimited km warranty on the car & the battery & they don't have any conditions on how you charge it.

Charging all the time at Superchargers will reduce the battery life but not by much. There is enough battery management built in to make sure you can't stuff it up too much. You can charge it on a 350kW supercharger but the car won't accept any more that 140kW & this is to protect the battery.

Battery degradation happens at the very top of the batteries capacity so driving to the shops & then plugging back in when you get home after having used 5% of the battery will increase degradation. Charging a NMC battery to 100% & leaving it sit at this charge for a month or 2 is also not good for it. In other words don't micro charge & don't let the car sit at full charge & not use it.

Other than that it isn't worth worrying about. The battery will most likely outlive the car. If you have a look at the Tesla High Mileage club on Facebook you will find Tesla owners with NMC batteries, many with early technology battery management software who have 200,000 to 500,000 miles and these vehicles are still going strong.

 

[tsedge]

Yes - all the posts above have clarified it, it is an effect but a small one and not one to worry about for most people, small overall effects.

 

[pollenface]

Personally, I would charge to 100% so my wife is not stressing.

Stressed wife = Bad.

The available info for the NCM battery on the internet suggests charging to 100% is fine if not leaving the car for months at a time, which you are not.

 

[hharzel]

Isn't the battery eligible for replacement only if its health drops below 70%? That's a lot and will cripple the SE especially in winter. Tesla Model S has so much range that it's still usable at 70% state of health.

 

[tsedge]

Isn't the battery eligible for replacement only if its health drops below 70%? That's a lot and will cripple the SE especially in winter. Tesla Model S has so much range that it's still usable at 70% state of health.

People are typically seeing even old batteries have 90%+, so the 70% is really a guard against a faulty pack, not what to expect when the car is older.

 

[Corindikev]

I believe the Tesla NMC degradation guide is about 6% per 100,000 miles without any care taken so after 300,000 miles (483,000 km) the car is still above 80% SOH.

If you look at the High Mileage Tesla FB page you will see all the worry bunnies comments similar to here from new owners (some of used & some new Teslas) and then others come on with 3-500,000 miles in a 2015 model with Whadaya worried about comments.

 

[pollenface]

I rarely see an ICE car above 300,000 km these days.

 

[firstMGEV]

I charge mine every time to 100% on a wall AC charger @ 7Kw but drive every day +/- 100km so the car never stays a long time @ 100% battery level.

You will end up melting the charger plug or socket

 

[Jto]

I charge mine every time to 100% on a wall AC charger @ 7Kw but drive every day +/- 100km so the car never stays a long time @ 100% battery level.

The LR is a lithium battery I believe and that likes to be charge to 80% if charging each day, charging 100% once a month will balance the battery cells, I would check your user manual for recommendation on charging LR battery. @ 80% you should have more then plenty to do a 100km drive.

 

[ari197]

You will end up melting the charger plug or socket

I believe you could only have 7Kw charge with a dedicated charge point (not granny charger), so there shouldn't be a worry about overheating.

But even if you use granny chargers (max around 3Kw), It all depends on the quality of your sockets.. I've driven a BEV for more than 6 years now and in all that 6 years, I've been charging from the same households sockets and still no sign of tear and wear.

 

[Jto]

I believe you could only have 7Kw charge with a dedicated charge point (not granny charger), so there shouldn't be a worry about overheating.

But even if you use granny chargers (max around 3Kw), It all depends on the quality of your sockets.. I've driven a BEV for more than 6 years now and in all that 6 years, I've been charging from the same households sockets and still no sign of tear and wear.

I am getting up three years on a granny charger and no problem with my one, it charges at a around 1.3kw which fast enough for me.

 

[Rolfe]

The LR is a lithium battery I believe and that likes to be charge to 80% if charging each day, charging 100% once a month will balance the battery cells, I would check your user manual for recommendation on charging LR battery. @ 80% you should have more then plenty to do a 100km drive.

I've posted this before, but it's worth putting it up again. The batteries really aren't all that fragile, and if you're not leaving it sitting at 100% for several days on a regular basis you should be fine.