MG4 Reduction Gearbox Oil Leak

[Deleted member 10041]

Your splitting hairs now, reporting of faults go hand in hand with customer care and how they are dealt with

 

[Hallix73]

Your splitting hairs now, reporting of faults go hand in hand with customer care and how they are dealt with

Not really, there must be a post on Dealer and MG service somewhere on here?.
This post is about oil leak and source of problem and fix.

 

[Deleted member 10041]

Not really, there must be a post on Dealer and MG service somewhere on here?.
This post is about oil leak and source of problem and fix.

Your having a laugh, so according to you owners just get to post they have a problem, and what the fix is in this thread. Any subsequent issues they are then having the need to jump to the specific dealer post in the dealer listings to chat about lack of support service etc.

That makes so much sense they are obviously unrelated.

 

[Cocijo]

My point is they dont need to contact customers over the slightest things that in your mind are a major crisis.

So there was no valid question to answer

This all kinda backs up my theory that using this forum is a negative experience because the 1% of whinger owners make it look like the happy 99% don’t exist.

The 99% are driving their cars and not onntheir knees everywhere looking for oil spots or rippled plastic covers

You have edited this post at least 3 times now - so I guess the content might change again. Anyway. Not sure where you get you % from? Others might challenge you in the fact that this forum is a ‘negative experience’.

 

[Hallix73]

Your having a laugh, so according to you owners just get to post they have a problem, and what the fix is in this thread. Any subsequent issues they are then having the need to jump to the specific dealer post in the dealer listings to chat about lack of support service etc.

That makes so much sense they are obviously unrelated.

I give in ...... you win.

 

[Deleted member 10041]

I give in ...... you win.

Cheers

 

[Oberoy]

Cheers

I'm afraid i'm with @Hallix73 I feel a more balanced view of the issue would help members. I feel that a small number of people post an overly negative view of the situation.
On balance I don't believe this is a major issue, and as you say many people don't have the benefit of @Hallix73 knowledge and so him giving this point of view is invaluable to members.
As I said earlier it would be far better if when people report this issue a consistent reply was made. Way back soon after the new breather became available MG UK said it's ok to drive until the updated breather is fitted. This causes the least inconvenience to the owners and in my view should be the approach.
By all means put forward your point of view, the issue I have with many of your posts is the way you respond and continue to do so until others with a valid point of view give in,this doesn't help the wider membership.

 

[AndyL61]

How do you know it's only a small amount of oil though, would you be willing to a 100% say that there will be no detriment to the gear box.

There is only 900mls in there to start with, if the car is leaking over a period of weeks could you say that it wouldn't lose enough to cause any undue wear through the reduced amount.

Some cars do not even have 900mls , remember when they were saying they were overfilled and reducing the amount of oil to 700mls to try to stop the leak.

 

[Ayoull]

On my old xtrail the gearbox has a leak following a front drive shaft replacement as the inner CV jointed had failed, the oil seal used wasn't seated fully.

The xtrails gearbox took 2L of oil, and was leaking when I spoke to nissan they said it will operate safely with as little as 0.3L and the gearbox was designed to hold 0.4L below the oil seal level for this reason.

So I'd imagine the MG4s gearbox was built with some level of contingency on its ability to work with less oil without damaging any components.

 

[WalkingBootWeather]

I find it hard to believe that manufacturers routinely design components that need to be overfilled with lubricant and simply expect that some will be lost. Apart from the additional cost and pollution issues, how do they know that sufficient will be retained to avoid damage.

In the case above with the Xtrail gearbox that only needs 0.3l, and oil seal is at 0.4l level why would anyone ever put more than 0.4 l in?

Either more oil is optimal and the design ought to retain that level, or less is required (in which case why ever add more)?

 

[Deleted member 9692]

I am not sure what your profession is and I know you like to comment in a way that knocks the MG4 in a negative way, hence you bought a Megan.
I am a recently retired Marine Chief Engineer and have degrees in mechanical engineering.
I have stripped down many gearboxes on large plants and even on my Triumph Stag.
Unless the box was totaly dry of any oil, so much so the gears could not pick up any oil to splash and form a 'boundary' lubriction between the faces of the engaging teeth then no damage to the gear teeth will occur. So based on the design and quanitity in the box (900ml) almost 1Litre, then I doubt that amount of oil could drip out of the breather to cause a problem.
Like I say once any car has the dripping oil and the new breather is fitted then move on and enjoy the car.

Remember, for example, MG were initially telling owners such as me to not drive my car over 50 mph when my gearbox had been drained and refilled with 750ml but yet was still leaking. One of the big problems here is the awful communication from MG re this issue and actually false information in many cases. As much as we all respect your undoubted expertise and knowledge in this field it is not from you that the reassurance should come, with respect. This is the reason why we have a nearly 100 page thread on here. Poor communication from MG and poorly executed system to deal with issues. If losing 25% of the oil that the box was designed to hold (onto driveways, roads and into the environment) is so insignificant then it should be super easy to communicate.

 

[Ayoull]

I find it hard to believe that manufacturers routinely design components that need to be overfilled with lubricant and simply expect that some will be lost. Apart from the additional cost and pollution issues, how do they know that sufficient will be retained to avoid damage.

In the case above with the Xtrail gearbox that only needs 0.3l, and oil seal is at 0.4l level why would anyone ever put more than 0.4 l in?

Either more oil is optimal and the design ought to retain that level, or less is required (in which case why ever add more)?

I can only comment what nissan told me over the phone when I called their technical help line, as I'm not mechanically minded in that sense.

But in terms of manufacturers over engineering I can comment from an electricity distribution prospect and can say HV transformers are built to hold more oil than needed to fulfil their job to account for potential leaks on joints, and also for deterioration of the oil. As they only have oil change every 10-15yrs or on a fault occuring.

So it wouldn't be implausible for a gearbox to be built to hold alot more oil than needed to account for people not getting cars serviced correctly if at all.

 

[troopercooper]

I am not sure what your profession is and I know you like to comment in a way that knocks the MG4 in a negative way, hence you bought a Megan.
I am a recently retired Marine Chief Engineer and have degrees in mechanical engineering.
I have stripped down many gearboxes on large plants and even on my Triumph Stag.
Unless the box was totaly dry of any oil, so much so the gears could not pick up any oil to splash and form a 'boundary' lubriction between the faces of the engaging teeth then no damage to the gear teeth will occur. So based on the design and quanitity in the box (900ml) almost 1Litre, then I doubt that amount of oil could drip out of the breather to cause a problem.
Like I say once any car has the dripping oil and the new breather is fitted then move on and enjoy the car.

I think given that the car has a 7 year warranty, a lot of the issues aren't deal breakers and I'd agree that its 'probably' fine.

But as a chartered engineer who also has various mechanical degrees, I think your assessment is wrong to claim that 'no damage will occur'. We simply don't know what the extent of the problem is and oil functions far beyond just being a lubrication, such as heat dissipation. There will be a minimum amount needed and due to a lack of clarity from MG, we don't know how much is actually leaking or the risk involved long term.

I'm happy to chalk all of the above up to the risks associated in buying a brand new model, but the fact remains that this is still a £30k car and the current state of communication from MG and their dealership solutions are not good enough in many cases. It's been months, something in the chain is going wrong somewhere for dealerships to be all on different pages, people should be concerned about that.

Given that a single email to all dealerships is a very easy thing to do and likely is happening, I'm willing to bet that the dealerships don't fully know because they're simply not being informed. So MG is therefore purposely not disclosing this, why? We don't know, but as customers we deserve clear guidance and answers.

 

[WalkingBootWeather]

Dealers often spout rubbish verbally. They are more reticent to put commit statements to paper where they can be challenged in court,

Good engineering leads to less leaking. Simply adding excess oil is a bodge at best. If there is a significant risk of oil loss or degredation then the service interval should be more frequent.

 

[Ayoull]

Dealers often spout rubbish verbally. They are more reticent to put commit statements to paper where they can be challenged in court,

Good engineering leads to less leaking. Simply adding excess oil is a bodge at best. If there is a significant risk of oil loss or degredation then the service interval should be more frequent.

You can make your service intervals as short as you like, you can't force someone to service their car correctly.

And with transformers we have over 45,000 on our network and take between 4-12hrs to fully drain and refill that's not including the maintenance required on tap changers. So 10-15yrs at 11/20kV is the norm across the industry.

But DGA (Dissolved Gas Analysis) always shows deterioration in the oils abilities to fulfil its role.

 

[Alb]

Service interval for gearbox oil is "Never" AFAIK.

 

[Ayoull]

Service interval for gearbox oil is "Never" AFAIK.

When I had a range rover Vogue it was listed as sealed for life, but had a drain plug and refill position, had it flushed at 80,000 as it was sluggish changing gears.

 

[Cocijo]

Out of interest, technically speaking does anyone know exactly what this gearbox does?

My understanding is it is a transfer box with standard differential gears.

It has only one fixed ratio and takes the power output from the electric motor transforms the rotational speed and transfers it via the differential to the road wheels.

If this is the case then it is not subject to the same amount of wear and tear as say a 5 speed conventional gearbox as it does very little in relative terms.

More like an axle than a gearbox.

I’m not entirely sure how this adds any value other than interest factor and a fuller understanding of how technical or complex the transfer box might be.
One of the engineering challenges with any gearbox is heat expansion which can cause oil loss if not vented correctly - this is possibly the issue here as speculated before.

 

[siteguru]

There are images of the gearbox / motor way back in this thread.

 

[Cocijo]

There are images of the gearbox / motor way back in this thread.

Oh - ok sorry I missed that! Mind you we nearly at 2000 posts now!