Range decrease due to cold weather [merged thread]

[Adam C]

I've had my MG4 LR in the garage last week as only getting 2.1 kpm, is this the normal for the time of year.

Thanks for your help.

I have the LR

This morning on a fairly short trip it was averaging 2.2 per kWh

I’ve just come back from a long round trip ( about 24 miles ) & it was averaging 3.5

This was driving in ECO mode.

Not sure what the temperature was this morning, chillier than right now but now it’s saying 12°

 

[fnegroni]

Am I the only one who wishes that when people post about consumption etc they would also include a picture of their driver screen, accumulated, since last charge, from start?

 

[Rolfe]

On Tuesday I did 100 miles in the daytime and got 3.1 miles/kWh. This evening I did over 90 miles and got 2.8 miles/kWh. But it wasn't at all cold considering the time of year. For shorter journeys in sub-zero temperatures I don't think 2.1 is necessarily abnormal.

 

[Ian Key]

On Tuesday I did 100 miles in the daytime and got 3.1 miles/kWh. This evening I did over 90 miles and got 2.8 miles/kWh. But it wasn't at all cold considering the time of year. For shorter journeys in sub-zero temperatures I don't think 2.1 is necessarily abnormal.

It's not. I do a lot of short journeys to the shops and the park with the dogs and only get 2.0 m/kWh in the cold weather. It's picked up to 2.5ish now the weather's warming up.
I don't worry about it. It just means I have to charge up a little more frequently but it's still a lot cheaper to run than my previous 2.0 diesel.

 

[nbenn]

Is the miles per kwh / kWh per 100km fully reliable (even accounting for its unreliability)?

I'm aware of winter drop but what I saw today has me questioning what the car is telling me.

Summer GOM Range: 360km approx
Winter GOM Range: 280km approx

Winter GOM efficiency: 20ish kWh per 100Km. so approx 250km

ACTUAL km achieved about 180km. I drove about 130km and it said about 50/60km left before needing charge.

This seems very low. I did a battery check this week and battery health was 95%. That's with temps this week from about 3degrees to 8 degrees.

That's about half the range of what the GOM says in summer. Have to say it's a bit disappointing.

 

[tsedge]

Is the miles per kwh / kWh per 100km fully reliable (even accounting for its unreliability)?

I'm aware of winter drop but what I saw today has me questioning what the car is telling me.

Summer GOM Range: 360km approx
Winter GOM Range: 280km approx

Winter GOM efficiency: 20ish kWh per 100Km. so approx 250km

ACTUAL km achieved about 180km. I drove about 130km and it said about 50/60km left before needing charge.

This seems very low. I did a battery check this week and battery health was 95%. That's with temps this week from about 3degrees to 8 degrees.

That's about half the range of what the GOM says in summer. Have to say it's a bit disappointing.

Normal winter range loss is 25-30% at those temperatures. However, the GOM is notoriously unreliable - this is the loss of actual range, so I suspect you don't actually get 360km in summer, accounting for the difference.

It is also dependent on terrain (hills), weather (wind) and driving style.

 

[fnegroni]

Possibly a case of lead poisoning of the right foot?

 

[nbenn]

Possibly a case of lead poisoning of the right foot?

I drive pretty efficiently. I don't drive on eco mode. I'm sure there are ways to squeeze out more efficiency but they seem excessive to me.

 

[fnegroni]

I drive pretty efficiently. I don't drive on eco mode. I'm sure there are ways to squeeze out more efficiency but they seem excessive to me.

And you have kept an accurate record of accumulated total and since last charge numbers that you can provide as evidence?
Do you reset your accumulated total? Is that why you get those range numbers?
I understand you are wondering why, but without data, hard data, how can we possibly comment other than with anecdotal evidence?

 

[nbenn]

Normal winter range loss is 25-30% at those temperatures. However, the GOM is notoriously unreliable - this is the loss of actual range, so I suspect you don't actually get 360km in summer, accounting for the difference.

It is also dependent on terrain (hills), weather (wind) and driving style.

I get the feeling this is the case. It makes sense based on what I'm seeing in winter. I must not have been getting 360km. I will say it did feel like I was.

Saying that EV database says combined 250km for winter. I'm seem to be getting 180km. Oh well.

 

[fnegroni]

Am I the only one who wishes that when people post about consumption etc they would also include a picture of their driver screen, accumulated, since last charge, from start?

I refer to my post above: on every conversation about efficiency, post the bloody pictures!

 

[nbenn]

I refer to my post above: on every conversation about efficiency, post the bloody pictures!

Here you go.. didn't bother with last charge. I'd only driven a few miles.

 

[nbenn]

2 miles / kWh is the minimum that it displays. It will often show this at the beginning of any drive as very short journeys are quite inefficient. It is trying to predict the range based on your recent driving but it is quite inaccurate.

Resetting the trips just resets this to the default range (which will be much higher than the actual) and it takes a few journeys for it to adjust back down again. It's a false prediction: what matters is the actual range you get.

Did you charge to 100% and wait for it for finish (to balance the battery)? It can take a long time to balance once at 100% in order to calibrate the battery. Obviously this needs to be on AC.

If you are only getting 140 miles on 80%, then you are using about 49kWh out of the available 61kWh, giving an average of about 2.8 miles / kWh - this is a normal winter figure that obviously depends on journey type and driving style. You are getting 175 miles out of a full battery, typical is 180-220, so it is on the low side but not particularly unusual.

To get more range, usual recommendations are:

• Use ECO mode with energy saving mode on.
• Ensure ECO mode is on the AC settings.
• Keep speeds down, eg 65mph or less on motorways.
• Avoid lots of short journeys.
• Gentle acceleration and braking to maintain momentum.

What does ECO mode in AC settings do?

 

[fnegroni]

What does ECO mode in AC settings do?

It limits the power consumption by the air con and the heater.
I run my HVAC on eco most of the time now, unless it’s freezing outside or above 20C, and it seems to be giving slightly better consumption, but I haven’t run a full OBD2 readout so I don’t have actual figures, and it might all be just placebo.

 

[jiiikoo]

Just did a ~80km journey and got consumption of 18.2kWh/100km. 85-105km/h speed throughout the journey (a few slowdowns in there tho). Not bad for -1C weather consumption wise.

Climate was at 24C and Auto. Normal driving mode.

Also got to take advantage of cheap DC charging (0.2€ per kW @ 75kW charger).

 

[Scr4ppy]

Hey all. Here’s my current xpower readings. I take it the fully charge total would get higher as it warms up?
Yesterday after charging over night and driving in eco mode and average speeds. On shortish local runs, I clocked about 35 miles. And had the miles/kw at about 4.5. But it then settled at 3.6. I guess this mate have been coz the battery was warm.

Today after another 10 miles this has dropped to 3.1miles/kw.

On the charging dash it’s shows 100% at 178 miles on normal and 188 on eco. I did notice that the hvac was one. And when that was off it was a bit higher.

Whilst I’m happy with the m/kwh. Is the range range about right? I bought the care secondhand from a dealer with 3700miles on the clock. So just want to make sure the battery is ok.

Cheers

 

[siteguru]

3.1 mpkWh x 61.7kWh = ~191 miles range 100% to 0.

 

[Rolfe]

To be honest, I have got to the point exemplified by the legendary Rolls Royce salesman. When asked about the horsepower of the latest top-of-the-range model, he simply replied, "sufficient".

My range is sufficient. 100 miles is about the limit of what I will do in a day as a round trip from home. I've done that twice this week, and come back with about 30% charge remaining each time. I officially don't care what the range is or what the miles/KWh is. The car will take me where I want to go and back, and then I'll plug it in.

Yes I do have contingency plans. Type 2 chargers in the car park where I park during the opera performances. Ultra-rapids on the way home where I could plug in for five minutes to get a bit more range in. It's good to have contingency plans. But it would be annoying to have to do these things on a regular basis, and right now I don't envisage having to do them at all.

That's the important thing, not what it says on the app at 100% charge, or on the GOM.

 

[Scr4ppy]

To be honest, I have got to the point exemplified by the legendary Rolls Royce salesman. When asked about the horsepower of the latest top-of-the-range model, he simply replied, "sufficient".

My range is sufficient. 100 miles is about the limit of what I will do in a day as a round trip from home. I've done that twice this week, and come back with about 30% charge remaining each time. I officially don't care what the range is or what the miles/KWh is. The car will take me where I want to go and back, and then I'll plug it in.

Yes I do have contingency plans. Type 2 chargers in the car park where I park during the opera performances. Ultra-rapids on the way home where I could plug in for five minutes to get a bit more range in. It's good to have contingency plans. But it would be annoying to have to do these things on a regular basis, and right now I don't envisage having to do them at all.

That's the important thing, not what it says on the app at 100% charge, or on the GOM.

I should have said I’m not worried about the range In general. As I usually do about 30miles a day to work etc. and now have a home charger. So I don’t need to worry that’s I’ll never have enough juice in the e mornings etc

The longest trip so far was a 150 miles round trip when it was -8 in the morning. I gave a little 9kw (as that’s all the charger put out over 3 hours) top up at the destination, and I wasn’t driving conservatively. I probably could have made the journey back with out the top up. But I was a bit worried and time constrained, so didn’t want the risk of needing a 15 min stop on the way back.

My main reason for posting was checking that the range @ full was about right. As it’s still under the dealers warranty.

 

[Rolfe]

Yeah, 150 miles at sub-zero temperatures is the sort of situation where a contingency plan might come into its own. It's great if there's a type 2 at your destination for days like that, and I think (hope!) we'll see more and more of these springing up. I've got a rule that if I get to Glasgow with less than 60%, I plug into one of the destination chargers in the car park. Yesterday I got there with 67% and home with 32%, so I was absolutely fine. But they're there if I need them. (And so are the Tesla superchargers at Maxim Park and the Fastned site at Hamilton, so I'm covered every way.)

I think your last paragraph puts your finger on it. People need to be reassured that their battery isn't dying on its arse when they see this range drop. I knew about it before I bought my car and specifically asked the dealer if it would in practice actually do 100 miles round trip in freezing conditions at motorway speeds and with the heating on full blast. But I was lucky I picked up on the point through watching videos - nobody specifically explained it to me when I bought the car, and if I'd been expecting 218 miles all the time every time I might have been quite narked. Or quite worried. No wonder new owners are coming here with concerns.

So long as we know the range will recover with the arrival of spring and summer, and that this isn't the start of an inexorable and irreversible battery deterioration, we should cope just fine.