SE Owners. Do You Believe That You Have Got The Version With The Best Value.

[Buster72]

I’m not sure the ‘oustanding value for money’ thing is valid any more.
Certainly in PCP and lease terms (the most popular means these days) there are other cars in the same price frame now, the MG isn’t a stand out.
Buying outright, no idea, I don’t bother filling brain space with that info.

Other cars in the same price frame. Such as...

 

[BishiBoshi]

I don't have an SE but I would have got one if it had the 360 camera, to be honest it's the only major trophy feature I'd miss.

 

[DevonMG4]

As I have previously mentioned, I have an SE SR. Having previously bought a top spec car, Ford Fiesta Vignale and felt that it was not worth the extra money, I decided to go for the base MG4 model. And having owned it for 6 months now, I am perfectly happy with it. And even as the base model, the level of equipment is exactly what I wanted. In fact the only thing it does not have that the Ford had was rear reversing camera. Unlike some others, I have not needed to change the wipers or tyres or anything else for that matter. And even the radio is ok.
So. To other SE owners, do you believe that this version represents the best value.

Absolutely best option for VFM, knew it didn't have a reversing camera, wish it did but I wasn't about to pay £6,000 for one. Never used inbuilt nav in a car, heavily a fan of G.Maps and so the Android Auto was a must have, use that relentlessly. Can't think of anything else that was a must have on the T model.

Biggest negative of either model is the very third tier dealer network, having previously experienced Mini and Toyota from new.

 

[tsedge]

I bought the Trophy and it was the best value for money for me, since it did what I needed and had the equipment I wanted.

Let's get things better in proportion here:

• In terms of equipment, we should be comparing the LR SE (£29,450) to the Trophy SE (£32,495), which is £3,045 (not £6,000) for a long list of equipment that the SE lacks, not just a reversing camera.
• In terms of range, the SR SE (£26,995) is £2,455 cheaper than the LR SE, so that's the extra to paid for range, faster charging and the different battery chemistry.

 

[DevonMG4]

I bought the Trophy and it was the best value for money for me, since it did what I needed and had the equipment I wanted.

Let's get things better in proportion here:

• In terms of equipment, we should be comparing the LR SE (£29,450) to the Trophy SE (£32,495), which is £3,045 (not £6,000) for a long list of equipment that the SE lacks, not just a reversing camera.
• In terms of range, the SR SE (£26,995) is £2,455 cheaper than the LR SE, so that's the extra to paid for range, faster charging and the different battery chemistry.

I can't recall the prices exactly but for my use case I was very happy with the SR and as a high miler it's been perfect. So my White SE was £26k rounded up to the nearest thousand, I seem to recall the T model was £32k if I'd gone for that in Orange - which would have been my choice.

So in my case it would have been a £6k reversing camera - but we all have different ways of evaluating value.

Also on reflection and referring back to the thread title, I can't help thinking that a 50kw battery that's happy being charged to 100% is much the same as a 60kwh battery that normally prefers to be charged to 80% - just saying ;-)

 

[Rolfe]

I don't think that last is true. If you're going to use the range then I don't think there's a particular problem charging the LR up to full fairly frequently. As far as I can see the issue is charging it up to 100% and then not using the charge so that the car sits at >80% for too long. I haven't heard anyone telling LR owners that they can't charge to 100% whenever they need that range, even if it's every day.

Also, you have the situation where someone may need the extra range often enough for it to be really convenient to have it, even if their daily driving only needs the 80%. So you're charge to 80% routinely, but the day you need that range, you just charge to 100% instead of having to make a stop at a rapid charger.

Horses for courses.

 

[tsedge]

I can't recall the prices exactly but for my use case I was very happy with the SR and as a high miler it's been perfect. So my White SE was £26k rounded up to the nearest thousand, I seem to recall the T model was £32k if I'd gone for that in Orange - which would have been my choice.

So in my case it would have been a £6k reversing camera - but we all have different ways of evaluating value.

Completely agree value is subjective. I just piped up because it sounded like the £5,500 difference didn't give you much, which it does, although it may be things you don't need or want, of course.

Also on reflection and referring back to the thread title, I can't help thinking that a 50kw battery that's happy being charged to 100% is much the same as a 60kwh battery that normally prefers to be charged to 80% - just saying ;-)

No it isn't, Rolfe is right, the extra range makes a big difference on long trips and I was more than happy to pay for it. The LR is also less affected by reduced range in low temps and charges faster with a better curve.

Of course, these things you may well not need/want either, which is fine.

 

[DevonMG4]

The LR is also less affected by reduced range in low temps and charges faster with a better curve.

A good point regarding charge speed

 

[Rolfe]

I think also that the LR is a no-brainer if you don't have home charging. Run it between 20% and 80% using rapid chargers, and there you'll get the benefit of the faster charging. Then you only have to find a type 2 charger you can sit on, or a loan of a wall box, or somewhere to plug in a granny lead, once a month to let the battery balance.

In contrast the SR charges more slowly at a rapid charger, and really really likes to go up to 100% and balance as often as it can. I don't think it likes operating between 20% and 80% without balancing, whereas the LR is fine about it. SR is great if you can just plug in and go to sleep and forget about it. Not so fine if you can't be at home while it's charging.

 

[Buster72]

I can't recall the prices exactly but for my use case I was very happy with the SR and as a high miler it's been perfect. So my White SE was £26k rounded up to the nearest thousand, I seem to recall the T model was £32k if I'd gone for that in Orange - which would have been my choice.

So in my case it would have been a £6k reversing camera - but we all have different ways of evaluating value.

Also on reflection and referring back to the thread title, I can't help thinking that a 50kw battery that's happy being charged to 100% is much the same as a 60kwh battery that normally prefers to be charged to 80% - just saying ;-)

Well said.

I think also that the LR is a no-brainer if you don't have home charging. Run it between 20% and 80% using rapid chargers, and there you'll get the benefit of the faster charging. Then you only have to find a type 2 charger you can sit on, or a loan of a wall box, or somewhere to plug in a granny lead, once a month to let the battery balance.

In contrast the SR charges more slowly at a rapid charger, and really really likes to go up to 100% and balance as often as it can. I don't think it likes operating between 20% and 80% without balancing, whereas the LR is fine about it. SR is great if you can just plug in and go to sleep and forget about it. Not so fine if you can't be at home while it's charging.

Balancing... never done this and have to admit I don't even know why or how.

Completely agree value is subjective. I just piped up because it sounded like the £5,500 difference didn't give you much, which it does, although it may be things you don't need or want, of course.

No it isn't, Rolfe is right, the extra range makes a big difference on long trips and I was more than happy to pay for it. The LR is also less affected by reduced range in low temps and charges faster with a better curve.

Of course, these things you may well not need/want either, which is fine.

Ok. But remember that you are carrying around a heavier battery pack. This is evident in the slower acceleration time. So that only benefits if you are constantly using the extra range.

 

[Deleted member 10041]

The lfp battery pack is actually heavier than the NMC, if you had equivalent kwh capacity
As it stands the SR is only 16kgs lighter than the LR, which is next to nothing and would make no noticeable impact on range.

Balancing... never done this and have to admit I don't even know why or how.

You have to balance charge the SR once a week or your battery health will suffer, long term it can damage your battery if you don't do it, and you will lose range, as you lose capacity in the pack

 

[tsedge]

The lfp battery pack is actually heavier than the NMC, if you had equivalent kwh capacity
As it stands the SR is only 16kgs lighter than the LR, which is next to nothing and would make no noticeable impact on range.

Correct, the difference in performance is almost entirely due to different gearing, not the weight.

 

[Rolfe]

Balancing... never done this and have to admit I don't even know why or how.

I don't know what sort of car or battery you have, but the LFP batteries will balance without anyone doing anything in particular so long as they are allowed to get to 100% on an AC charger and then left alone for half an hour or so without stopping the charge. They putter around on about 20 watts for half an hour making sure all the cells are in balance, then (if you're watching the app) announce that they're done, and charging stops completely. It's recommended to let the battery do this at least once a week, but in fact it will do it every time it gets to 100%. Mine did it five days in a row once. It never passes up the opportunity.

Since most LFP drivers will be charging to 100% on an AC charger anyway, it just happens. As there's no facility to stop the charge earlier in the app, it's normal behaviour.

NMC batteries are happy being taken up and down between 20% and 80%, and will balance to some extent on an AC charger if the app is set to stop at 80% and the charge isn't stopped. However it's recommended to charge them to 100% once a month on an AC charger and let them balance at that SoC. Then to drive them down to 80% charge the next day because they don't like sitting at a high SoC, something the LFP battery is OK about.

We had a member here a couple of weeks ago driving a second-hand SR which was reporting some weird range figures which seemed very abnormal. The owner of an LR immediately chimed in with "somebody was probably taking it to 100% all the time, not supposed to do that." On further inquiry the true problem appeared to be the opposite, that the car hadn't been taken to 100% nearly often enough and hadn't been able to balance. Once he had done that a few times the range started to look sensible.

The SR has a very flat power curve (or something) which makes it harder for the battery management system to estimate the range, and it needs to balance to get a reasonable range estimate as well as for battery health and long life.

 

[Buster72]

I don't know what sort of car or battery you have, but the LFP batteries will balance without anyone doing anything in particular so long as they are allowed to get to 100% on an AC charger and then left alone for half an hour or so without stopping the charge. They putter around on about 20 watts for half an hour making sure all the cells are in balance, then (if you're watching the app) announce that they're done, and charging stops completely. It's recommended to let the battery do this at least once a week, but in fact it will do it every time it gets to 100%. Mine did it five days in a row once. It never passes up the opportunity.

Since most LFP drivers will be charging to 100% on an AC charger anyway, it just happens. As there's no facility to stop the charge earlier in the app, it's normal behaviour.

NMC batteries are happy being taken up and down between 20% and 80%, and will balance to some extent on an AC charger if the app is set to stop at 80% and the charge isn't stopped. However it's recommended to charge them to 100% once a month on an AC charger and let them balance at that SoC. Then to drive them down to 80% charge the next day because they don't like sitting at a high SoC, something the LFP battery is OK about.

We had a member here a couple of weeks ago driving a second-hand SR which was reporting some weird range figures which seemed very abnormal. The owner of an LR immediately chimed in with "somebody was probably taking it to 100% all the time, not supposed to do that." On further inquiry the true problem appeared to be the opposite, that the car hadn't been taken to 100% nearly often enough and hadn't been able to balance. Once he had done that a few times the range started to look sensible.

The SR has a very flat power curve (or something) which makes it harder for the battery management system to estimate the range, and it needs to balance to get a reasonable range estimate as well as for battery health and long life.

Thank you for this. Very interesting.
I have an SE SR, so an LFP battery and although I always charge at home albeit with a so called Granny charger, I routinely charge to 100%.

 

[Rolfe]

So every time you charge to 100%, so long as you don't intervene to stop the charge as soon as the car reaches 100%, it will balance. Takes about half an hour.

I have mine on the granny charger right now (7.40). It has got to 91% SoC and the app and is charging at 1.87 Kw. The app says it will be finished at two minutes past ten. However I know from previous experience that when that time comes the car will not stop, it will reduce the power drawn to 20 watts, and stay at that for another 30 minutes. After that it will stop drawing any power and the app will return to the display it shows when the car isn't charging.

This is how the SR is supposed to be managed.

I was confused because your profile says you are not driving an MG.

 

[PeteC]

Also on reflection and referring back to the thread title, I can't help thinking that a 50kw battery that's happy being charged to 100% is much the same as a 60kwh battery that normally prefers to be charged to 80% - just saying ;-)

I agree that in everyday use with no long journeys there will be little practical difference between an SR and an LR. But I would expect things to be different on a long run where you need to recharge. My Trophy is still taking well over 50kW at 80% (your equivalent to 100% in the SR). I assume (but will happily be corrected) that an SR charge rate will slow down to well under 50kW once it's at higher percentages, just as the Trophy does when in the 90%'s. For my use, that's a good enough reason for buying the larger battery. If I only did one or two long journeys a year, then I might well think differently!

 

[Rolfe]

On the other hand, if we refer back to the thread title, the question was whether SE owners thought they had the best deal. The title doesn't specify the SR battery, necessarily. So you may have an excellent reason for wanting the extra range (or perhaps if you don't have home charging the NMC battery suits your requirements better), but in that case it's the SE LR that needs to be the comparator against the Trophy. With the same battery, is the SE better value?

 

[tsedge]

On the other hand, if we refer back to the thread title, the question was whether SE owners thought they had the best deal. The title doesn't specify the SR battery, necessarily. So you may have an excellent reason for wanting the extra range (or perhaps if you don't have home charging the NMC battery suits your requirements better), but in that case it's the SE LR that needs to be the comparator against the Trophy. With the same battery, is the SE better value?

Exactly my point, Well said.

 

[Deleted member 10041]

Other cars in the same price frame. Such as...

You can get 23 plate ID3's with 15-20 miles on them, better range than the SR (265) same performance and better kit, heated seats etc for £4 more a month on PCP.
Both £5k deposit, 10000 miles and 48 months.

MG 4 SR £325

I'd 3 pro performance £329

Both rear motor rear wheel drive, so will handle similar.
Deals are out there

 

[PeteC]

On the other hand, if we refer back to the thread title, the question was whether SE owners thought they had the best deal. The title doesn't specify the SR battery, necessarily. So you may have an excellent reason for wanting the extra range (or perhaps if you don't have home charging the NMC battery suits your requirements better), but in that case it's the SE LR that needs to be the comparator against the Trophy. With the same battery, is the SE better value?

It probably is! My pre-order was for an SE LR as my head said it was better value than the Trophy. Then on the day of the test drive when we confirmed our order, both my wife and I basically said 'bu**er it' and went for the Trophy! We've never had a new car before (we're both in our 70s) so we thought we might as well go for it.